UPDATED: Air Source Heat Pumps/Air Con - Full Info & Guide, is it cheaper to run than mains gas?

Irishguy

Has anyone taken out a maintenance plan for a Worcester Bosch (Greensource)Air to Water heating system.

I had a system installed 3 years ago, didn't realise at the time that the unit only came with a 2 year warranty.

Anyway, surprise surprise the sysem has developed a fault something about a 4-way value. I've called Worcester Bosch they want £400+ just to come out and look. I then enquired about a service plan as I can't find any company thats willing take on coverage and the yearly maintenance plan with Worcester Bosch is £420. Isn't this excessive?

I thought going with this system was to save me money but I feel I’m getting screwed everyway I turn. Wish I’d gone with gas.

I've yet to see any savings. My annual energy bill is £1200 which for 2 people I think is high as my neighbours all report the same price for a gas heating, same size of house.



I've yet to see any savings.

matelodave

Had a minor problem with my heating - one of the underfloor heating thermal actuators went short circuit and blew a fuse in the Daikin Hydrobox (not a Daikin fault, just the way the system is configured). I've just had it fixed & serviced £150. My annual service (which is fairly cursory as there's not much to do except clean filters, check pressures and ensure teminals are tight) cost me £90 and is done by the company that did the installation.

AFAIK Daikin themselves charge about £350 for a service

Regarding you costs, I would have thought that you'd save a fair bit - our average for all our energy needs (cooking, lighting, heating, hot water etc) is about £850-900- it will be less this year due to last years mild winter and the late start to this one - my estimate is £750).

A lot depends on how you are using the system and the temperatures you have for heating & hot water.
A heatpump system works differently to a conventional system and so needs to be set up and operated differently to get the best out of them. Lower temperatures but on for longer will save you money compared with trying to run it like a gas boiler.

lovesgshp

Irishguy wrote: »

Has anyone taken out a maintenance plan for a Worcester Bosch (Greensource)Air to Water heating system.

I had a system installed 3 years ago, didn't realise at the time that the unit only came with a 2 year warranty.

Anyway, surprise surprise the sysem has developed a fault something about a 4-way value. I've called Worcester Bosch they want £400+ just to come out and look. I then enquired about a service plan as I can't find any company thats willing take on coverage and the yearly maintenance plan with Worcester Bosch is £420. Isn't this excessive?

I thought going with this system was to save me money but I feel I’m getting screwed everyway I turn. Wish I’d gone with gas.

I've yet to see any savings. My annual energy bill is £1200 which for 2 people I think is high as my neighbours all report the same price for a gas heating, same size of house.



I've yet to see any savings.

With the 4 way valve, then you need to check the operation of it from the service/installer menu. Any good plumber should be able to replace it easily with the same or equivalent unit.
I have linked to a file where you can access the correct menu to check the operation, so hope you are using the Rego 800 controller. The WB unit is probably the IVT Optima

http://www.google.it/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CDEQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.geothermansi.com%2Fdownloads%2F12343%2520Optima%2520600-1700%2520Installation%2520guide.pdf&ei=FXR8VPqUH83baIPogvgG&usg=AFQjCNHrR8NaCwV4jAtvS2O9JwS88k0gOw&sig2=UKG2ZjEoPseib7mGXSSELw

amtrakuk

Not had any personal experience though I understand air to air heat pumps are great until down to about 3-5c when they start losing their efficiency. also there is a substantial amount of noise from the fan when it it running. i guess that's why only a few are using them.

matelodave

amtrakuk wrote: »

Not had any personal experience though I understand air to air heat pumps are great until down to about 3-5c when they start losing their efficiency. also there is a substantial amount of noise from the fan when it it running. i guess that's why only a few are using them.

Ours is quite happy down to about -5 before the auxiliary heater will kick in and we've been comfortably warm down to -15 outside. I accept that it uses more power when it's everso cold (but so do all other forms of heating) but we still get more kwh out than we put in whatever the outside temperature

Regarding noise, well that's quite subjective.

Our twin fan Daikin unit is not as noisy as leaving my car ticking over outside and we can't hear it unless we walk past it.

It's only the ventilation fan pushing air through it that causes the noise, the actual fan motor & compressor are inaudible unless I put my ear onto the casing of the outside unit.

There is the same amount of noise indoors from the circulating pump in the hydrobox as there is from any other wet heating system.

I always think it's a bit dangerous just repeating hearsay rather than actual personal experience

Swipe

I have two Daikin 3.5KW air to air split units. They are not noisy at all. in fact, even when it's running flat out and standing next to one, I can still hear my neighbours oil flue over the fan noise.

dweaver

Just an update on my Ecodan problem. The installer turned up on Monday and did some diagnostics on the unit with the help of Mitsubishi. They deduced it was a faulty compressor and said I needed a new Ecodan! He then went away to arrange the warranty replacement. As he didn't get back to me that day I phoned Mitsubishi on Tuesday to complain as I'd been without heating for 3 days and the wife wasn't happy! To be honest, the helpline weren't very helpful and kept saying it's the installer's issue to deal with. They did confirm he'd raised the warranty paperwork and the unit had been delivered to Plumb Center. He arrived today (Wed) in the afternoon and replaced the Ecodan so now I'm up and running again (at last). I'm still going to complain to Mitsubishi as I think they could be more helpful, and relying on one installer is never going to provide a quick fix. Also, their 24/7 helpline isn't answered by anyone and they've also remove the link on the website to be able to search for an accredited Ecodan installer!
As captainhindsight says, sometimes it may be better to sacrifice performance for reliability and backup. Although, on the reliability side, my installer said that of his 65 Ecodan installs, this is the first failure he's had so maybe Mitsubishi aren't expecting them to fail and so haven't setup the required support network.
I'll let you know what they come back with...
Dave

[Deleted User]

amtrakuk wrote: »

Not had any personal experience though I understand air to air heat pumps are great until down to about 3-5c when they start losing their efficiency. also there is a substantial amount of noise from the fan when it it running. i guess that's why only a few are using them.

Hmmm...


2C outside and our flow temp is 38C. Outside unit just emitting a woosh of air unlike noisy oil boilers flu. Our Ecodan is happy down to -25C without immersion backup. Being rural Scotland we have had -16 with no issues heating a 100+ year old detatched house.


Not sure where you get your information...?

Andy_WSM

amtrakuk wrote: »

Not had any personal experience though I understand air to air heat pumps are great until down to about 3-5c when they start losing their efficiency. also there is a substantial amount of noise from the fan when it it running. i guess that's why only a few are using them.

This is a myth that perpetuates because people post it as a matter of fact. You start your "statement" with "Not had any personal experience", so as others have done, let me share mine.

It was -3C here yesterday morning and my heat pump was still working lovely maintaining indoor temperatures at 21C. It only had to defrost itself once in 3 hours and that took it less than 5 minutes to do.

The "noise" is like a large fan blowing and my (now dead) condensing gas boiler flu made more noise than the heat pump does.

Yes, old heat pumps were not well suited to colder climates, but years of R&D had bought them on a long way and newer technology, newer refrigeration gases has made them both more efficient and quieter.

I had a heat pump a number of years ago that was as you describe, noisy, inefficient, unreliable. But then I also used to drive a Ford Cortina that was like that - we've moved on.

MTad

Does anyone have any experience of Lailey & Coates ASHPs?