HDMI cable - £5 vs £55 (discussion)

spud17

Rik, please could you supply a link for the peer review report?

Marty_J

aliEnRIK wrote: »

If you believe his findings are falsified, then by all means tell the ASA who will HAVE to look into his claimed readings

Let me know how that goes :rolleyes:

Someone already did Rik when he made the claims in the first place. Russ Andrews apologised for trying to suggest his mains cables could reduce harmonic distortion in an amplifier; he said this was a typographical error. The ASA basically concluded that Russ Andrews' statements were without any scientific basis, and misleading.

I find it rather odd that you're portraying those who want to apply scientific principles to something as "flat Earthers", and those who don't care about scientific evidence and rely purely on their own senses as enlightened Darwinians who believe in a round Earth. It's actually the other way round Rik. The Earth looks pretty flat when I look out my window, yet science tell me it isn't. I can either go with what my senses tell me, or what science tells me.

ETA: Here are Mr Andrews' "findings":

http://www.russandrews.com/viewindex.asp?lookup=0&region=UK&currency=GBP&article_id=cableclamptestresultsA&customer_id=PAA0716021009406EXJXXSZIIEWDRXMC

No mention of how the tests was carried out, the methodology used, or who actually did the test, aside from saying it was a "consultant". The tests, even if they're acccurate, also don't actually show that they make anything sound/look better. All we're told is that they "back up" their subjective tests.

sillygoose

Your all wrong, its ACTUALLY to do with the colour of the electricity your using. Any idiot can clearly hear that blue tinged electricity sounds much cleaner than the red shaded type.

You should always align your HDMI cables North/South to avoid crossing the Earths magnetic flux, modulation of which by the Suns influence can clearly be seen as a pixel being 2 shades off and a faltering in the purity of female vocals. I have for sale Krypton cored cables bathed with holy water - PM for details only £300 and you can bore your mates (or is that mate?) at the pub for weeks mulling over your wise purchase.

Simple facts - at these current levels and frequencies almost any conductor will do. Oxygen in wires doesn't really slow electricity down. Gold plating is just to avoid corrosion as copper goes yucky (tinning is just as good but doesn't impress teenagers so much). Screening is only vital to analogue signals and to how powerful an influence you are screening from. Unless an HDMI (digital) cable has to be wrapped a few turns around Kenwood blender in your lounge don't sweat it. The main issues with cable length are not resistive losses but reactive losses - two conductors alongside with an insulator in between form a capacitor, the longer the cable the higher the capacitance, a capacitor 'shorts out' an AC signal - not much you can do about it really apart from keep the conductors further apart, nothing to do with the conductor, just nice thick insulation is best.

I certainly don't intend getting drawn into this debate so thats it, but after 25 years in the top end of the electronics industry (defence, aerospace etc) this thread has given me enough laughs to bring about tears for which I thank you all sincerely.

You may proceed with flaming me - Best shots only please, just be advised I will not actually in anyway, give a damn.

spud17

You should always align your HDMI cables North/South to avoid crossing the Earths magnetic flux, modulation of which by the Suns influence can clearly be seen as a pixel being 2 shades off and a faltering in the purity of female vocals.

Please,what correction factor should be used in relation to the proximity of Ley Lines?

thescouselander

Marty_J wrote: »

Someone already did Rik when he made the claims in the first place. Russ Andrews apologised for trying to suggest his mains cables could reduce harmonic distortion in an amplifier; he said this was a typographical error. The ASA basically concluded that Russ Andrews' statements were without any scientific basis, and misleading.

I find it rather odd that you're portraying those who want to apply scientific principles to something as "flat Earthers", and those who don't care about scientific evidence and rely purely on their own senses as enlightened Darwinians who believe in a round Earth. It's actually the other way round Rik. The Earth looks pretty flat when I look out my window, yet science tell me it isn't. I can either go with what my senses tell me, or what science tells me.

ETA: Here are Mr Andrews' "findings":

http://www.russandrews.com/viewindex.asp?lookup=0&region=UK&currency=GBP&article_id=cableclamptestresultsA&customer_id=PAA0716021009406EXJXXSZIIEWDRXMC

No mention of how the tests was carried out, the methodology used, or who actually did the test, aside from saying it was a "consultant". The tests, even if they're acccurate, also don't actually show that they make anything sound/look better. All we're told is that they "back up" their subjective tests.

Interesting results indeed

" The tests show that each of our cables reduce RFI to a substantial degree, typically between 300% and 1000% across a wide frequency range!"


How is it possible to reduce anything by more than 100%?

Marty_J

thescouselander wrote: »

Interesting results indeed

" The tests show that each of our cables reduce RFI to a substantial degree, typically between 300% and 1000% across a wide frequency range!"


How is it possible to reduce anything by more than 100%?

It's not. If you reduced RFI by 100%, you'd eliminate it completely.

He also uses some jerry rigged system which "injects" RFI, rather than testing it on a regular domestic electricity supply. I don't know about anyone else here, but I don't inject RFI into my mains.

According to his tests, a regular mains cable reduces RFI anyway. I'm wondering if it reduces it enough to virtually eliminate it in a normal domestic supply, which is why he needed to increase the amount of RFI to show how good his cables are. The regular cable also does better than some of his cables at certain frequencies, and has a much smoother response; all of his cables peak and trough like crazy.

I certainly wouldn't buy his cables on the strength of this "evidence".

aliEnRIK

Marty_J wrote: »

Someone already did Rik when he made the claims in the first place. Russ Andrews apologised for trying to suggest his mains cables could reduce harmonic distortion in an amplifier; he said this was a typographical error. The ASA basically concluded that Russ Andrews' statements were without any scientific basis, and misleading.

I find it rather odd that you're portraying those who want to apply scientific principles to something as "flat Earthers", and those who don't care about scientific evidence and rely purely on their own senses as enlightened Darwinians who believe in a round Earth. It's actually the other way round Rik. The Earth looks pretty flat when I look out my window, yet science tell me it isn't. I can either go with what my senses tell me, or what science tells me.

ETA: Here are Mr Andrews' "findings":

http://www.russandrews.com/viewindex.asp?lookup=0&region=UK&currency=GBP&article_id=cableclamptestresultsA&customer_id=PAA0716021009406EXJXXSZIIEWDRXMC

No mention of how the tests was carried out, the methodology used, or who actually did the test, aside from saying it was a "consultant". The tests, even if they're acccurate, also don't actually show that they make anything sound/look better. All we're told is that they "back up" their subjective tests.

Marty ~ those are not the test I speak of (Well its a small part of it, the catalogue goes into more detail and other tests)

aliEnRIK

The 'actual' test was done as follows ~
measured the 'noise' created by an 800 (ish) quid amp using standard cable and all through the frequency spectrum
Then changed to one of his leads and did the exact same test. His lowered the 'noise floor' measureably. He did various test with various leads and used 3 of EACH lead just on the chance that 1 wasnt upto scratch in some way and got the average result of all 3. The result was a 'MEASURED' difference. He also has ABX blind test results.

Wether anyone buys his leads on the strength of these tests I couldnt care less (I wouldnt ~ theyre far too expensive). But I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that they DO work as ive tried them myself.

Either believe me, or dont..............

aliEnRIK

NickMidgley wrote: »

I'm not saying he's right or wrong, but I'd be reluctant to take anything like that in a sales catalogue at face value - especially one published by someone who's already had his butt kicked for making misleading claims.

I know where your coming from

Lets look at the facts ~

He couldnt MEASUREABLY prove his 'claims', so was forced to reword his catalogue until such time he could. The 'bad science' brigade went nuts saying how its been BS all this time when in fact he had varified ABX blind tests results which the ASA wernt interested in. It HAD to be measured.

So he spent a lot of time and effort (And money) to get an outside firm in to try various tests out until such time he COULD measurebaly prove the leads do what hes claimed all these years (Kind of unfair I thought, as I KNOW they work just by using them)

So hes now PROVEN that braided cables lessen mains bourne RFI through an amplifier. An amplifier that all the other 'experts' said would eliminate all mains bourne noise anyways. So THEYVE been wrong all this time

Now, Russ has quite a following and hes REALLY into his 'hifi'. The ASA has already smacked his hand. Hed have to be a total fool to falsify his results as his company would die a horrible death. Is he REALLY going to jeapourdise his reuptation by publishing false results knowing hes being watched by so many when he STILL sells tons of cables etc anyways?

I think not...........

aliEnRIK

spud17 wrote: »

Rik, please could you supply a link for the peer review report?

Hi Spud

Im awaiting to see if he publishes his findings online (I hope he does as it would be so much easier)

But if he doesnt do it soon, I may scan some of the catalogue for you and post here if you wish?