Public-private wage divide gets 50% wider

Sir_Humphrey

baby_boomer wrote: »

Unlike you I never take the mickey by posting on my employer's time - partly out of respect, partly because I know they'd sack me and have the systems in place to do so.

For you that should read employers' since there are 35 million of us taxpayers. Unfortunately for us, your employers' systems seem to be inadequate .

I am quite capable of doing more than one thing at a time. Perhaps you do not make cups of tea at work either, or maybe you pee into a bucket next to your desk? ???

Have you walked through a mile and a half through snow to get to work today?

MissMoneypenny

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

A bank clerk would be equivalent to an AO or AA (the latter are rare now due to minimum wage issues). An EO is equivalent to a small branch bank manager. EO = Bank Manager = Captain Mainwaring

It just goes to show the massive wage increase civil servants have received.

I use to help my mother with her mortgage because her HEO salary was so low. I remember once when an interest rate rise had taken place, I paid all the mortgage increase as my mothers HEO salary couldn't cover it and my bank clerk salary could. BTW, she worked for Ag &Fish.

Sir_Humphrey

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

It just goes to show the massive wage increase civil servants have received.

I use to help my mother with her mortgage because her HEO salary was so low. I remember once when an interest rate rise had taken place, I paid all the mortgage increase as my mothers HEO salary couldn't cover it and my bank clerk salary could. BTW, she worked for Ag &Fish.

I'd like to see you raise a family in London on 25-30k a year. A friend of mine can barely manage on an SEO salary. Of course wages are higher now than 30 years ago. So are prices, it's called inflation.

MissMoneypenny

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

I'd like to see you raise a family in London on 25-30k a year. A friend of mine can barely manage on an SEO salary. Of course wages are higher now than 30 years ago. So are prices, it's called inflation.

I grew up in London, so we were being raised on the low civil service wage in London, until I went out to work. No tax credits then either and I believe child benefit wasn't paid for the first child?

The promise then was, as public sectors don't make money for the country and are paid for by the private workers, then they took a very low wage but had a large pension.

Now we have public sector workers having vastly increased wages (as i have shown above) but are still wanting a large pension. The pension has to go, the private sector can't afford that and their high wages.

carolt

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

A starting wage for a teacher in London is £25k. A starting wage for a bank clerk in London is about £15k.

Yet back in 1972, a new bank clerk on a starting grade, earned more than an HEO and teacher.

You can see why the large civil service pension was justified back then, but it certainly isn't now.

Have to agree with Sir Humphrey - an HEO is paid quite a bit more than a bank clerk, but that's justifiable. It's not an admin grade - HEO's are lower-middle managers, so you wouldn't expect them to be paid the same as a clerk. If that happened in the 1970's it's good that's changed - you get what you pay for.

Certainly, the Grade 7's I know are paid in the region of 40-50K but are in charge of millions of pounds of public money and hugely important initiatives that can't be so quantified, eg education, health policy etc. A private sector job with equivalent responsibility would be paid far, far higher. As a comparison, the same Grade 7's have been offered consultancy work at £1000 A DAY. Not a week.

So clearly the money is far worse in the public sector - FOR EQUIVALENT JOBS.

That's the problem with the OP - the article doesn't compare equivalent jobs, only whether they're public or private, and is therefore meaningless.

But very useful for stirring up envy.

A good example of 'divide and rule', I wonder? :rolleyes:


Oh, and forgot to add, if you paid teachers the same as bank clerks, you'd have no teachers - who'd choose to study for 3-4 years, when they could save the fees and time and earn the same anyway? Maybe when education was free, that was less clear cut. Now fees have to be paid and grants no longer exist, I fear you'd get a very poor quality of teacher - the dregs who weren't good enough to hack it as bank clerks.

beecher

carolt wrote: »

That's the problem with the OP - the article doesn't compare equivalent jobs, only whether they're public or private, and is therefore meaningless.
.

Without a doubt.

And agree that bank clerks should not be earning the same as teachers - seems a crazy comparison to me.

Andy_L

The actual report
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/CCI/nugget.asp?ID=285&Pos=2&ColRank=2&Rank=384
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/StatBase/Product.asp?vlnk=15187

It's fairly useless for public vs private comparision because:
1. As Sir Humph said, most low paid public sector jobs have been contracted out.
2. Its based on PAYE employees so ignores the self employed who are exclusively private sector and, I would suspect, higher paid than the average.
3. It's an apples & oranges comparison as it bulks everyone into each sector eg
"The lowest paid of .. were .. ‘Sales occupations’" who are predominantly private sector whilst "he highest earnings.. were ‘Health professionals'" who are predominantly public sector employers. Instead of, eg, "State teachers vs Public school teachers"
4. It ignores non cash perks, eg company cars which are (almost?) exclusively a private sector thing

beecher

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

Now we have public sector workers having vastly increased wages (as i have shown above) .

You haven't shown that at all. All you've done is compare two jobs, which are totally unlike each other in every way.

Old_Slaphead

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

Have you walked through a mile and a half through snow to get to work today?

Wow, have you ? If so, then you're clearly not a teacher.

baby_boomer

Sir_Humphrey wrote: »

I am quite capable of doing more than one thing at a time. Perhaps you do not make cups of tea at work either, or maybe you pee into a bucket next to your desk? ???

I'm allowed to have a cup of tea and go to the loo, but not to post endless arguments onto the internet.

Just think how much more efficient you and your colleagues would be if the same rules applied to you .

Perhaps you could recommend it to your minister :rotfl: ?