Black Dog of Depression - can we help each other?

pipkin71

Good luck with your wii fit, LW.

I did try the girls but couldn't do it, so just go on every now and then to check my weight ect.

sandy71

pipkin71 wrote: »

Well, I'm not offended, and think you have given a good response, the way you see it.

Yes, there are definitely times when empathy works, but it isn't always the case and with health professionals, they will have different ways of working.

Agree with FG, sometimes people just clash, and it is easier to change the person you are seeing, rather than face a difficult time and then resent going. That doesn't always make them a bad health professional.

Of course, there are good and bad out there - patients and health professionals, and yes, those treating depression do need to have an understanding of it, but from experience, I don't think piles of empathy will always be the right way to go, when dealing with someone who is depressed.

Support forums are different to real life, and here, empathy, hugs and kind words can do a lot for the person who is at a difficult moment, so these types of thread can have their uses at times.

I haven't set out to offend either, and hope no-one thinks I have

Now you see thats pretty much what I was trying to say, I just have trouble getting the right words out.

LameWolf wrote: »

Anyone want a laugh?

Imagine, if you will, an overweight, extremely unfit Wolf, with a BM of mumblety-mumble, a dodgy back and two gammy knees attempting to use her new Wii Fit.

That'll be me in a few minutes.

Feel free to take bets on how many times I end up flat on my @ss.:D

I'm deliberately keeping out of any "debate" type stuff because I simply cannot handle it.

I'm still keeping you all in my thoughts though, and wish only the best for all my friends here.:o

LW glad to see you here. At least we are debating now instead of arguing;)
Good luck with the Wii fit, I'm rubbish at it. I have no co ordination:rolleyes: We went everywhere trying to find one and it has now been sat under the tv for the last 6 months gathering dust

My friend dropped in for a coffee earlier and we ended up playing Wii sports resort. She is REALLY religious and doesn't swear or anything, I have got to say at the end of the game I was shocked at what came out of her mouth. :rotfl:

absolutebounder

pipkin71 wrote: »

Well, I'm not offended, and think you have given a good response, the way you see it.

Yes, there are definitely times when empathy works, but it isn't always the case and with health professionals, they will have different ways of working.

Agree with FG, sometimes people just clash, and it is easier to change the person you are seeing, rather than face a difficult time and then resent going. That doesn't always make them a bad health professional.

Of course, there are good and bad out there - patients and health professionals, and yes, those treating depression do need to have an understanding of it, but from experience, I don't think piles of empathy will always be the right way to go, when dealing with someone who is depressed.

Support forums are different to real life, and here, empathy, hugs and kind words can do a lot for the person who is at a difficult moment, so these types of thread can have their uses at times.

I haven't set out to offend either, and hope no-one thinks I have

as ever pipkin you get it right. yes there has to be some empathy and yes there can sometimes be a clash of personalities though this should be very rare if therapists are taught correctly. However i have heard of therapists who get on "too well" with clients (no not sexual sense) by agreeing with them all the time. A therapist has to remember that the client has a problem and if that problem has persisted for some time whatever the client is thinking or doing is likely to be at least in part wrong. For the client to get better there has to be change and whilst it may not be what the client wants to hear honesty is the best policy. there are some therapists who have gone into therapy who have suffered from various mental ilnesses and that is fine provided they are stronger than their clients problems. sad to say many are not and this leads to a situation where all is nice and friendly but no one gets better.
the rigidity of the NHS gives it problems. What happens say if you have an hour appt and get a defensive client suffering from anxiety and it takes an hour to brea\k down those anxieties? You have to end the session just as you were getting somewhere but by the next appt the client will have thought about all the barriers you have smashed and put them up again so you are back to square one and going nowhere.

feelinggood_2

I can't really discuss this with you AB as I've never actually had any time with a therapist!

pipkin71

absolutebounder wrote: »

For the client to get better there has to be change and whilst it may not be what the client wants to hear honesty is the best policy.

This, of course, is where problems can arise.

Telling someone what they want to hear, means that their learned behaviour isn't challenged, and so it continues.

Tell someone the truth though, and their defences build up, as they feel under attack, and suddenly, you're the bad person for telling them the truth.

By not giving truthful help, the behaviour continues and the person doesn't get better, however, challenge the behaviour, and although it may not change overnight [and indeed, may not change at all] there can be changes because a person is no longer playing along with a particular need.

It's so difficult finding the right path to take, and even professionals will no doubt get it wrong, but understanding is such an important aspect and doesn't need to go hand in hand with empathy.

absolutebounder

feelinggood wrote: »

I can't really discuss this with you AB as I've never actually had any time with a therapist!

Not a lot I can say to that:rotfl:
Apart from If you did have a session with a therapist what would you expect or want from him / her?

absolutebounder

pipkin71 wrote: »

This, of course, is where problems can arise.

Telling someone what they want to hear, means that their learned behaviour isn't challenged, and so it continues.

Tell someone the truth though, and their defences build up, as they feel under attack, and suddenly, you're the bad person for telling them the truth.

By not giving truthful help, the behaviour continues and the person doesn't get better, however, challenge the behaviour, and although it may not change overnight [and indeed, may not change at all] there can be changes because a person is no longer playing along with a particular need.

It's so difficult finding the right path to take, and even professionals will no doubt get it wrong, but understanding is such an important aspect and doesn't need to go hand in hand with empathy.

You are so right.
you did miss one point though. what if the therapist gets the client to change by seeding ideas in the clients mind and then letting the client believe it was their idea all along. that way you can be honest and non confrontational.
i am also very careful with language (not here I know) in that I dont say things like "why dont you do this" I ask "how would it be if it was like this?" how is far less confrontational than why. i also listen to see how the client represents things. ie are they visual and make pictures in their mind or are they say touchy feely. that way I can change my language to how they represent things which makes for better understanding. there is a whole host of tricks to break down anxiety and defensiveness but at the end of the day if time is short it is not easy and often leaves the client and therapist unsatisfied

sandy71

absolutebounder wrote: »

You are so right.
you did miss one point though. what if the therapist gets the client to change by seeding ideas in the clients mind and then letting the client believe it was their idea all along.

Thats how I get my hubby to agree to my colour schemes when we are decorating. He thinks it was all his idea.:rotfl:

feelinggood_2

absolutebounder wrote: »

Not a lot I can say to that:rotfl:
Apart from If you did have a session with a therapist what would you expect or want from him / her?

I don't know - if I knew how to think my way out of this I would, but I can't so I need someone to teach me how to recover. I see it as a language I don't know.

Ken68

Could have done with PALS recently.
Came from 24 hr hospital care to 24hrs nothing. Live solo.Horrible first week.
Tried Welcome home from Hospital, but guess all booked up for XMAS.
Full marks to neighbours... very good .
Having a good laugh now tho, just reading pills booklet about side effects.
Good thread LameWolf.