NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

D.A.

As far as I'm aware, the News Letter article posted by ballyblack above is pretty much spot on.

joylikes2shop

Update from the Administrator 30 March 2010




The First and Deputy First Minister have made a proposal to the Treasury to help savers in the PMS.
This will require approval from the Treasury and the Ministers are meeting the Prime Minister this week.
The Administrator has not been informed of the full details of the proposal but the First and Deputy First Minister have said in a statement that their plans will assist creditors and provide practical help to deal with the hardship experienced by small savers.
Any assistance which improves the position of members and creditors would be very welcome.
If the plan is approved, the Administrator will assess its implications and will advise members and creditors of the next steps as soon as possible.

http://www.presbyterianmutualsociety.co.uk/

joylikes2shop

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/letters/presbyterian-mutual-saved--for-members-votes-14748755.html

freddiemae

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/7539436/Northern-Rock-investors-to-get-nothing.html

Dr._Who_2

Special Meeting of General Assembly - Tuesday 13th April 2 p.m., Assembly Hall, Church House - Business: "To consider the present situation for savers in the PMS and to respond to a recent initiative of the Northern Ireland Executive"
This should be a public meeting - Ministers & Representative Elders.
Are we making progress - lets hope so, after all this time. (See also PCI website)

Dr._Who_2

Sorry - may have given mistaken impression in my post when I wrote "This should be a public meeting - Ministers & Representative Elders" What I meant - Ministers & Rep. Elders can attend and vote it is a public meeting in the sense that people can come and hear the proceedigns from the gallery, as happened at the Assembly last year - please pray about this meeting as it could be crucial to finding a way forward. (Should sackcloth & ashes be worn by some??)

Silent_Witness_2

Silent_Witness wrote: »

Hello John2009,

What is it that you would like to know vis-a-vis my identity? - that - I am a pensioner holding a current bus pass - that I am a PMS member, that my wife is a PMS member, that I am going to lose £20,000:00 if the Administration of PMS under Insolvency is the correct process; that I am a Presbyterian Elder, that I am a trustee of more trusts that I could spontaneously outline in 5 minutes, [one being The Howie Christian Charitable Trust] and wait for it - that I am listed as a Trustee of the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church in Ireland. What odds - anyway - outside of that.

To get with the programme - the rationale behind co-ordinating the application of the HCCT into the Chancery Court evolves from the reality that:

1. There was an abject failure by the legislatures in not having in place good regulatory governance in fiscal and monetary matters generally.

2. There was at least a prima facie case for suggesting that the conduct of the Directors and Officers of the Society fell below that which was required of them by law.

3. The greed and self serving impulses in the world of Banking.

I outlined this rationale in the early part of 2009 to my fellow HCCT trustees [and others] and I also recorded that the Presbyterian Church was a very effective marketing representative fot the Presbyterian Mutual Society and that Presbyterian Mutual members are entitled to have the breach of trust to which they were then [and continue to be] subjected remedied.

In relation to re-instatement of monies and remedies to PMS members:-

I am on record as outlining the correcting process for 1,2,and 3, to be:

(a) Directions of the court on the correct process for the Administration [first request in that regard to the Administrator was on 27 May 2009];

(b) Determination as to the level of Indemnity available from Government [and how long has that been goin on for? !!!]; - maybe we are now into happy days post Policing and Justice - who knows?

(c) Determination as to the level of Indemnity available from the Directors and Officers of PMS;

(d) Determination as the the level of Indemnity available from the Professional Adviser to PMS;

(e) Determination as to the level of Indemnity available under any breach of EU legislation.

and staying further with the programme:-

(i) (a) and (b) should be determined shortly - What about a deadline of 31 March 2010 for that;

(ii) (c) John23 - you might like to re-call a previous posting of your own [1005] and you will be able to deduce how your reasonings in that post dovetail into (c) above - are you up for those proceedings? If (a) and (b) come together giving pound for pound back for shareholders and loan note holders alike - then there will be no need for anything else to be done. If you are not up for 1005 action - I am trustee of a small fund which will be wiped out completely if the Administration is to be processed under Insolvency legislation - and I will follow through on John23's 1005 posting.

If I was a betting man, I would take any odds, that the legal position in relation to any PMS shareholder wishing to proceed as outlined at post 1005 is that he or she is in no worse a position than any other creditor.

Lets leave (d) and (e) for the moment - time for me to go back to being silent!! [John23 your postings have been most constructive - from 944 onwards - on posting 1009 I might disagree - I think the HCCT have the best!

Tiocfaidh 'ar la'

Ready now for stage (c)? - (a) secured on 12 February 2010, (b) about to come into the public domain any day now [my deadline prediction was today - 31 March 2010] and on (c) -

From Hansard - Wednesday - 24 March - Dr Ian Pearson (the Economic Secretary to the Treasury) paragraph 87 WH.... ... ... "Reports by the administrator to DETI make it clear that the manner in which the society was run, and the actions of certain directors, were highly questionable"... ... ....

Going silent for another period:cool:

abeliever

To Silent Witness & other MSE contributors


Why not seek/organise a £300m interest free loan from HMG?

Over a ten yr period the commercial property would generate £70m of rent & the loan portfolio, another £20/£30m.

At the end of 10 years, loans & commercial property would be sold to pay back HMG the £200m balance.

Perhaps I'm missing something !!

ballyblack

We can only hope all these options are being discussed with HM Treasury?

D.A.

Dr._Who wrote: »

Special Meeting of General Assembly - Tuesday 13th April 2 p.m., Assembly Hall, Church House - Business: "To consider the present situation for savers in the PMS and to respond to a recent initiative of the Northern Ireland Executive"

a.k.a. To ask congregations to stump up a big pile of money in the hope that they'll just forget that the PMS directors were inept.

If I'm not mistaken, there are rumours that it could be at least £10 from *every* member of PCI.