NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

goodbyepci

http://www.detini.gov.uk/cgi-bin/morenews?util=1584

joylikes2shop

I typed this up yesterday, but due to computer problems I couldn't post it until now.

Whilst the meeting with Enterprise Minister Arlene Foster yesterday didn't result in any concrete information, it was still a very positive meeting.

There was no point at the meeting going over 'old ground' ..trying to find out who was to blame etc.

Our 'aim' was to try to gain some insight into what is being done NOW.

When asked the question ''Do you believe we are savers ?'' the answer was an emphatic ' Yes ' ....Ms Foster did suggest that comments had been made in the past which had lead to some confusion in this area, however she was in no doubt that those with money in the PMS were definitely savers.

It was agreed that the various points we had re:legislation would be addressed in follow up communication from DETI.

During the course of our questions, the following points came across....

That Arlene Foster (DETI) is committed to seeking a solution to the current situation.

DETI has received letters from many people, including those challenging legislation, as well as personal stories of hardship etc.To this end it is the intention to see that EVERYONE is treated FAIRLY.

Between all the Government departments in NI and UK,there is a tremendous wealth of financial expertise and therefore many possible options were being considered to find a solution, including looking into the feasibility of rescuing/saving the PMS in some form.

The Working Group set up by the Prime Minister meets on a weekly basis. Until a solution is found there is no easy way of updating savers on what has been discussed, and they are mindful about raising peoples hopes, or causing unnecessary worry in the interim.

We highlighted the fact that the current PMS situation is a problem affecting people in both the North and the South of Ireland.

The out come of, and the investigation into, the Auditors of the PMS will not cause any delay in the Working Groups decision.

We queried if the Administrators (legally) confidential report to DETI could in turn be made public by DETI (once personal data has been removed etc).. Apparently it cannot.


Ms Foster came across as very genuine,concerned and approachable. Despite our group being ''out of our comfort zone'' the meeting was quite relaxed.At the end of the meeting when we asked if there was anything that had been discussed that we shouldn't repeat.We were told ' No', so that is why I'm happy to share this information on the forum.

The information above is just a short summary of my personal view of how Thursdays meeting went.I have sent a fuller version by email to my PMS contacts and I've also sent it by PM to some others who have posted on the forum in the past....so check your Private Messages...even if you haven't logged in for a while.

PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS INFORMATIUON IS NOT 'STRICTLY CONFIFDENTIAL' AND MAY BE PASSED ON TO ANY OTHER PERSON. IF YOU WISH TO DISCUSS THIS WITH ANY OTHER SAVERS PLEASE DO SO !:rotfl:

joylikes2shop

Another Protestant church to close on Derry's west bank


Published Date: 24 August 2009

Another Protestant church on Derry's west bank could be about to close.
A massive question mark hangs over the future of Strand Road Presbyterian Church - one of the oldest Presbyterian churches in the city.

Since the outbreak of the 'Troubles', the Strand congregation has slumped from around 300 families to just over 90 as Protestant families moved to the Waterside and further afield.

Sources believe the church is no longer a viable proposition and could close - bringing the number of Presbyterian closures on the west bank to three. The previous closures were at Great James Street and Claremont, on Northland Road.

A meeting of the Strand congregation is expected to be held in early September to start assessing the way ahead.

The church's Kirk Session has already been looking at the situation and is expected to report to that meeting.

The church's caretaker minister, the Rev. Robert Buick, says the Derry and Donegal Presbytery is aware of the situation at Strand which has been ongoing for some time and will consider the future of the church once the congregation has reached its decision.

"Any decision taken by the Derry and Donegal Presbytery will then have to go to the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church for ratification," says Mr. Buick.

It is understood the church and buildings at Strand Road need a massive amount of money for repairs and the finance and congregation simply isn't there to have the works carried out.

The church is one of a number to have had money tied up with the Presyterian Mutual Society which crashed some months ago and, while this hasn't helped the situation, it's believed it would only have been a short term fix had it been available.

Mr. Buick says he believes there is great potential in the Strand Road but the future ministry there might have to be a different type of ministry.

"Something like an outreach centre," he said "but the decision is in God's hands and that of the congregation."

http://www.derryjournal.com/journal/Another-Protestant-church-to-close.5581581.jp

Dr._Who_2

Thanks for the visit to the Minister - such meetings are never easy as you couldn't be sure what reception you would get. Thankfully it was sympathetic and positive even though didn't provide much fresh information. However, it's important for everybody to understand that this problem hasn't simply gone away therefore we have to keep meeting with people and keep it to the forefront of people's minds esp. PCI minds, I think.
Come Septemebr there may be a need for meetings of savers with PMS - these happened before in different areas so we need to look out for them. We had one back before the summer in the Coleraine area which was called as a result of discussion in the Presbytery (then Coleraine, now Coleraine & Limavady). Like to have the sanction & support of the local Presbytery for this. Will flag up if another one is happening.

fivealive_2

Dr._Who wrote: »

Thanks for the visit to the Minister - such meetings are never easy as you couldn't be sure what reception you would get. Thankfully it was sympathetic and positive even though didn't provide much fresh information. However, it's important for everybody to understand that this problem hasn't simply gone away therefore we have to keep meeting with people and keep it to the forefront of people's minds esp. PCI minds, I think.
Come Septemebr there may be a need for meetings of savers with PMS - these happened before in different areas so we need to look out for them. We had one back before the summer in the Coleraine area which was called as a result of discussion in the Presbytery (then Coleraine, now Coleraine & Limavady). Like to have the sanction & support of the local Presbytery for this. Will flag up if another one is happening.

Thanks for all your contribution to this thread. Please let us know if/when there are any "public" meetings for savers in the North-West, I belong to a church in the Presbytery of Derry and Donegal and I have never been aware of a "savers meeting".

totallyletdown

Dr._Who wrote: »

Thanks for the visit to the Minister - such meetings are never easy as you couldn't be sure what reception you would get. Thankfully it was sympathetic and positive even though didn't provide much fresh information. However, it's important for everybody to understand that this problem hasn't simply gone away therefore we have to keep meeting with people and keep it to the forefront of people's minds esp. PCI minds, I think.
Come Septemebr there may be a need for meetings of savers with PMS - these happened before in different areas so we need to look out for them. We had one back before the summer in the Coleraine area which was called as a result of discussion in the Presbytery (then Coleraine, now Coleraine & Limavady). Like to have the sanction & support of the local Presbytery for this. Will flag up if another one is happening.

Yes, please let me know if there are any meetings. I just want to talk to others who are in the same position as me.

Dr._Who_2

A list of Directors should be available in the most recent copy of a Financial Report of PMS i.e. to 31st December 2007: noting appears to have been issued since. Unfortunately, I haven't got a copy - I think that the Rev. Sidlow McFarland may well have resigned following the debacle surrounding PMS: I think the Rev. Shaw Thompson is still there as is the Rev. Dr. Derek Poots. As to others I don't know.
I can understand those with strong feelings about no longer giving to PCI - this is an inevitable reaction to feeling let down. Certainly giving to United Appeal was badly affected in 2008 - this was a reflection of the PMS problem and the attitude of PCI to it but another factor is the present economic climate.
I, and others, feel that far too much money is needed to service Church House and its various departments - administrative headquarters need "slimmed down" so that more money stays where it is needed i.e. in local Congregations. Almost 70% of a local Congregation's income goes to "Church House" in various ways.
Perhaps a declining income may force a focussing of minds and lead to some much needed redunancies in Church House. Not that I want to see people out of a job but e.g. in days when we're told that we're short of Ministers and cannot meet the needs of Congregations there are far too many Ministers employed in Church House in admin. positions. Do away with those positions and these people wouldn't be out of work - they can always go back to what I believe the call of God is about - a call to the parish ministry!!
Much of this is funded by United Appeal, which suffered a major short fall of almost £250,000 last year!!

HOPE

Do you know how many clergy and administrative support staff are actually employed?

Donegal

Hi Folks, just found this site ten minutes ago so forgive me for not reading all 150 odd pages of this thread yet! I am very interested to hear of this PMS Savers Coalition. Is this something which could/should be set up on a regional basis?

joylikes2shop

Welcome aboard Donegal..:beer:..I'm assuming you are a PMS saver, and if so it's a shame you didn't know about this site ages ago because you might have been able to gain some comfort or support from others in the same position as you, long before now .

I am part of the PMS Savers Coalition which has been mentioned on the forum recently.

At the moment the 'group' is made up of approx 10 individuals, who are from various different locations including the Belfast,Antrim,Lisburn,Ballymena,and North Down areas.

Due to the forum rules,we cant put our personal contact details on the main forum so this -plus everyone's natural reluctance to 'admit' they've been caught up in this whole PMS mess -has meant it has taken AGES to even get the 10 members of the coalition together.

Once you have registered on the Moneysavingexpert site, you can start to post stuff in the forums AND get in touch ''behind the sceens'' via the PM (private message) facility....Just click on the name of who ever you'd like to send a message to and a new screen will appear. Once you look around this screen you'll find the 'send a new private message' bit...I'm sure you'll be able to work it from there.

I'm short on time now so cant explain much more for now, but I'll send you a PM shortly just to make sure you've got the hang of it all.

I'd be keen to see if the PMS Savers Coalition could contact/reach more people than we currently do. We all have our own bunch of people that we send emails to, or ring to update on any PMS biz... Until we can work out if it would serve any purpose or if we'd even be able to manage it ( remember we're just a bunch of like minded 'randomers' who've been thrown together and who are only trying to do what we can.I realise that we'd probably struggle to cope with contact from even 1,000 people let alone potentially 10,000 !! ) please feel free to PM me if you'd like to be included in the updates.