Karate price for my son. Am I being ripped off?

tutkusmom

Hi Julie,

I believe our children go to same Karate School on different days.I paid for my daughter go there up until black belt but once she gets her black belt,she will be going somewhere else.

You get a free uniform when you start (white)but my daughter has been asking me to get her the same uniform as the instructor has which is black with the logo on it.I was told by another mum that they were given the chance to by the uniform half a price once they paid for their membership in full up until black belt.The uniform is £100!!!! and when i mentioned about other mums telling me the offer they were given i was politely told that they never had a such an offer like this it was either probably either a buy one get one half a price deal i was talking about which i wasnt ;i believe put me in a situation as if i was not telling the truth and after for a bargain or something.I asked many mums there and some told me they recieved a free plain black uniform which they don do anymore and some was charged £50 instead of £100 for the uniform and the school is adamant they have never done anything like that and i beleive they are simply lying which is not professional at all so you can imagine they werent very happy with me when i said i was going to write a complaint letter to their head office.When i asked where the figure comes from for the uniform ,i was told it was a good quality uniform!!!! and it had a logo on it.I said i wanted to buy a plain black uniform from somewhere else and i was told i wasnt aloud to do that.I still don't know what to do next as i am in 2 minds to keep my daughter there for another 3-4 years with her now uniform even though it will be small by next year or buy a uniform on ebay ,just plain black one and put it on her and see and don't care what they say.I don't remember saying or signing on anything that i had to buy the uniform from their school and not somewhere else as i already paid up until black belt,they have no other option but to keep my child there until she gets her belt but we'll see when i write the complaint letter and send it whether i might get a respond or not.

Good luck to you,i know there is a martial arts school in Longlevens and GL1 Leisure centre also runs martial art classes so i will be moving my child somewhere else once we are done with this school.

tutkusmom

Julie ,have a look at that.

http://www.martialedge.net/martial-arts-school-directory/karate/samurai-martial-arts-gloucester--longlevens/

trevorg_2

JulieJesta wrote: »

Hello,
I won't name the place my son goes. But he's nearly finished a 3 month trial.
To carry on IMO is realllllly expensive. We were quoted £2600 for "blackbelt" course. We would have to pay this in monthly amounts, based on an average child/adult taking about 3 years to work up to that level. We would STILL have to keep paying, even if damon quits in a year. To me, that seems barely legal. My son WANTS to do karate though, but i know this is more than we can afford, and i'd have to borrow.

When i mentioned this I was told i could pay £1800 in one lump at the begining, but thats still 2thousand in debt!! for a hobby!!

Everything in me says this is wrong, but my son wants karate. Anyone who goes to karate, or whose children do, please let me know what you paid?

We live in gloucester, and am particularlly interested to hear of cheaper local clubs. Preferablly on more pay as you go terms. I do NOT like the tie-in with the karate club my son attends. then its also the kit. Punching gloves, uniforms, belts which must all be bought from the club directly and a £20 pound per belt change "grading" fee. Thats alot on top of what they want upfront!

Hello Julie

I can categorically state that if you are being asked for this kind of money up front you are being ripped off.

I have been training for over 35 years in karate and, if I may say so, do know my way around.

This thread appeared on another forum to which I belong, e-budo,
see this link
http://www.e-budo.com/forum/showthread.php?p=470544#post470544
and you may want to go on the site, register, and say who you are and what its about and I imagine you would find it useful to send some PMs to the respondents.

In truth and especially to those who are aware of these things there is no such thing as a 'black belt course'. It takes about 4 years of serious study to achieve black belt and even then the level is only the beginning of learning of what is a lifetime's study to which most of dont achieve. I am still learning and I am 6th dan.

So what is serious study ? It just means the student studies to the best of his ability without a specific goal in mind. it may take one year of intensive training, or 10 - it doesnt really matter because achieving black belt shouldnt be the goal. If a student trained diligently say twice or perhaps three times a week then in 4 years he/she might achieve the 1st dan black belt.

In any event you should not be asked for the money up front even though if your child spent a tenner a week for 4 years it would come out to around £1850 assuming he trained 46 weeks a year.

Hope this helps and, as we say, Osu,

Trevor

mutley74

you can buy reasonably priced karate/judo suits from soccer world, JJB Sports and on Ebay. Not worth paying the £25+ fees clubs charge for a martial arts suit for a growing child.

RobertoMoir

JulieJesta wrote: »

Hello,
I won't name the place my son goes. But he's nearly finished a 3 month trial.
To carry on IMO is realllllly expensive. We were quoted £2600 for "blackbelt" course. We would have to pay this in monthly amounts, based on an average child/adult taking about 3 years to work up to that level. We would STILL have to keep paying, even if damon quits in a year. To me, that seems barely legal. My son WANTS to do karate though, but i know this is more than we can afford, and i'd have to borrow.

Right. Stop right there. I used to be a judo instructor before injury made me give it up and I've heard about these sorts of places before.

Anyone who offers you a price upfront, especially with a timeframe, to "get" a black belt or the equivalent in any martial art is ripping you off, period, end of discussion. And don't get me started on places that claim you have to buy the equipment from them.

Grading for something like that depends on the ability, attitude and time a student has. You simply can't expect to earn a black belt in this way because you might not be good enough, or you might not have the time it takes or you might lost interest halfway through.

Let me put it this way, if your local art college asked for £2600 up front to turn you into the new Leonardo da Vinci in 3 years, you'd run a mile right? Same thing here.

Far better to find a club that is more relaxed and lets you pay on a week-by-week basis as you like, lets you train how you like and grade when you are ready and only guarantees that whatever happens the students will have fun trying.

tutkusmom

I don't want to hijack Julie's thread but would you be able to advise as to how to handle the situation as our children go to the same club and i paid in full for my daughter to attent there up until she gets her black belt.I was not mentioned about the price of the uniforms when my daughter first started(you get a basic white uniform for free anyway to start with) or the rule of having to buy it from them and not somewhereelse.I have no idea why would a uniform cost £100 just because it is good quality and it has a logo on it.My daughter's uniform is fitting her just fine at the moment but with children been children i have got this problem with her getting taller as she gets older and i feel like in 6 months time she is going to need a new uniform.

I bet they already dislike me for questioning their price for the uniform and not bending over to whatever they say but as my friend remind me the fact that i am now stuck with them and all i can do is suck it up and get on with it.

Shall i just buy my daughter a new uniform from somewhere else and take her there with the new uniform and let the hell break or give up on the idea and count it as an experience??What are your ideas on that please??

I am going to write a letter to the owner of the club but i do not hold much of a hope to get a respond from him.

ailuro2

We paid £45 for our DD's martial arts suit, it is made of very dense material so it can be pulled around and not tear, so I don't mind the cost. The jacket part has the club's badges embroidered into it, the trousers are plain white made from the same thick material.

I have also bought my DD a pair of bigger size trousers from a local martial arts shop so when the trousers are getting a bit short I can extend the life of the costly suit by letting her wear the longer trousers with the jacket.;) Maybe I'll cut off the badges and sew them onto a cheaper suit next time she needs one.:money:

fwiw we do a mixed martial arts class, a combination of Ao Denko Jitsu, Tae Kwon Do and Chung Do Kwan Karate.

It is £3.75 a class for kids, £4.75 for adults, for an hour long class. £25 for each grading which initially happens 4 times a year, then less frequently as the belts get more advanced, we have an 'hours' system where we have to do a number of hours in class before sitting the next grading, and only when our instructor says we are ready.
Annual membership-insurance is £23 for each person, no matter their age.

Because it also teaches kids (and adults!) how to deal with bullies, and how to pass strangers in the street and keep an eye on them without starting fights etc, how to defend yourself when someone tries to punch your lights out or stab you, it is more useful, imho, than some other martial arts which need good flexibility, lighting reactions etc. to make a difference.

As for paying up front, treat it the same as those modelling agency scams that want paid up front for portfolios of pictures etc - don't touch it with a bargepole!!:eek:

tutkusmom

I had to send my daughter to a martial arts school because she is very gentle and very caring and because of the way she is who she is she got bullied big time.She couldn't cope with the classes at all when she first started because it was noisy and she use to put her hands on her ears,cry and shake.even though i may come across as a bad mum,i had to insist her to carry on so that she built up a bit of confidince.It is heartbreaking to listen to your child in her sleep saying please dont hit me it hurts.She is a lot better now,she is much more confident and she will tell you exactly how she feels about you such as,don't snatch my book,i had it first or don't hit me,she got louder which i like,you can actually hear what she is saying when she talks to you.She still wouldn't dare to hit,kick anyone which is not ideal anyway and she never has in her life.I never had the terrible twos with her,never had any behaviour problems at all.

Now for the paying the price in full,the school is the only martial arts school that is in walking distance for me and i don't drive,or you can take the bus and get off the but in front of it which is handy.Most schools take children in from the age 6+where i live and i just couldnt wait for her to be 6 for the sake of her because she has to learn how to defend herself . I first paid £395 for 6-8 months of training which they said till orange belt.I am still to this day confused as what they meant when they said orange belt because it is a long way before they achieve it.After a couple of months they come up to me and said we have an offer ,if you pay £1000 in full your child can train until she gets her black belt.When you are in a situation where you have to pay a further £600 poundish 4 months down to line and having to keep paying it at the same rate for the next 3 years or so just because this is how much the training cost you,you simply jump on the idea and pay it in full and feel relieved for the fact that you do not have to worry about the school cost anymore.

They graduate every 2 months at the moment and it could be because they are in dragons classes(for children between the ages 3-6).They start with a white belt,then they get white belt with red stripe,white belt with yellow stripe,white belt with orange stripe,white belt with green stripe,white belt with blue stripe and so on.Once they get their white belt with black stripe the belt colour changes to red belt with white stripe,yellow belt with white stripe,orange belt with white stripe,green belt with white stripe etc.and once they have all these belt colours it is a plain yellow belt i think they achieve but i am not sure as we are not there yet.My daughter will get her white belt with blue stripe in the middle of december.When they reach the age of 6 they train in the same classes with adults.

Overall it looks like a good school but very expensive and after the uniform incident,i have no intentions of keeping my daughter there.I was even going to start her to learn extreme martial arts there once she was 5 1/2 as this is the youngest age they accept students but i am not going to bother with that either(You have to pay a further £200 per year for your child to train to learn extreme martial arts for the same school alongside the costs of school)

skipsmum

Had to jump in on this one!
I'm a karate instructor, teaching kids club. My husband teaches adults and kids, and does judo as well. Both my kids train.
If you join our club you would expect to pay:
week 1) come and watch us, try us out free
week 2)£25 trial joining up fee - covers insurance etc.
£4.50, £5 or £6 a lesson for 11/2hours

weeks 3 - 12) weekly lesson fee £4.50-6 each
week 13 - if you still enjoy it, £25 for 1st grading, plus £25 full membership. There are no more membership fees to pay.
At this point you may want to buy a gi £21.50 from us, or use one you already have, but they are not compulsory.
Mitts pads and mouthguard are compusory, £20 from us, or anywhere you like. Or borrow ours (not the mouthguard!)
From here on there are just lesson fees and gradings every few months. We have 6 "pay for" grades and it takes about 7 years to get to black belt, training hard 2 or 3 times a week. My son is 2nd Kyu, brown, and has trained for about 6 years.
I always discourage parents from buying uniforms straight away as a lot of kids find karate isn't for them. We keep outgrown ones to pass on where we can.
In the kids club we teach good manners and discipline as well as fitness, karate and self defence. The mixed and adults class focus more on actual karate.
Hope this is of some use,
Skipsmum

skipsmum

Tutuksmom,
Even the best quality competition gis are only about £65 - my dense, good quality ones are about £40. My sons good quality judo gi was £25, embroidred with all the club bumf. I find it hard to see how they can justify £100 on a bit of cloth!