White vinegar = acetic acid? ( non brewed condiment )

withabix

Non brewed condiment is just a name for a vinegar substitute made from food-grade, industrial ethanoic acid.

Cheap brands of white vinegar used to be made from non brewed condiment and used to be called "vinegar".

Now they're still made from non brewed condiment but aren't allowed to be called vinegar any more, hence the appearance of large containers labelled "non brewed condiment".

It's still 'vinegar', but is manufactured from chemicals, rather than by the oxidisation of ethanol.

They're not allowed to sell it in bottles which look like vinegar bottles, so it's often sold in 5 litre plastic containers.

If it's in Makro it will be in the bulk catering section with the 20 gallon drums of cooking oil etc.

Swan_2

there was a thread here about the same subject just a few days ago, maybe one of the mods can merge the two?

iainkirk wrote:

They're not allowed to sell it in bottles which look like vinegar bottles, so it's often sold in 5 litre plastic containers

I don't know about anywhere else, but here in Scotland non brewed condiment is still sold in vinegar look-alike bottles. I've a Gold Star brand nbc one & a Crosse & Blackwell malt vinegar one in my cupboard & they look identical apart from the labelling ... & the contents of course

squeaky

It was indeed a very similar thread and so I've merged the two together as you can see.

We have some older threads about white, or clear, vinegar collected in the Cleaning Section of the MEGA Index too, listed under vinegar.

HTH

thatblonde

Please go to Google and put in the search vinegar and petroleum. Many cheap brands of white vinegar use acetic acid to make vinegar which is a by product of petroleum. You know, like your plastic grocery bags are made from petroleum? Please look at the labels on vinegar. If it does not say from grains or organic, it could be poison named vinegar. Heinz brand comes from corn, that's a safe one.

geordie_joe

thatblonde wrote: »

Please go to Google and put in the search vinegar and petroleum.

Because everything on the internet is the gospel truth, and nobody on the net would just try and spread mis-information to scare people?

thatblonde wrote: »

Many cheap brands of white vinegar use acetic acid to make vinegar which is a by product of petroleum.

Reading the rest of your post I doubt you know the meaning of the phrase "a by product"

Also, being a by product of petroleum does not mean it is bad.

thatblonde wrote: »

You know, like your plastic grocery bags are made from petroleum?

No, they are made from a by product of petroleum, but you don't seem to know the difference.

thatblonde wrote: »

Please look at the labels on vinegar. If it does not say from grains or organic, it could be poison named vinegar.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

thatblonde wrote: »

Heinz brand comes from corn, that's a safe one.

try drinking eight gallons of it in one day, you'll soon see how safe it is.

Penelope_Penguin

squeaky wrote: »

No.

I used to work with acetic acid and it is wa-a-a-ay stronger than vinegar. Nasty stuff.

More concerntrated, you mean Acetic acid has an intrinsic "strength" irrespective of its concentration

thatblonde wrote: »

Please go to Google and put in the search vinegar and petroleum. Many cheap brands of white vinegar use acetic acid to make vinegar which is a by product of petroleum. You know, like your plastic grocery bags are made from petroleum? Please look at the labels on vinegar. If it does not say from grains or organic, it could be poison named vinegar. Heinz brand comes from corn, that's a safe one.

What a load of uninformed nonsense, but Geordie Joe has already said that :rolleyes:

Penny. x

Elk_3

I found this page googling... hilarious scaremongering in here!

Vinegar is an approximately 5% solution of acetic acid, although the concentration can be as high as 22% in some supermarket "pickling vinegars". In vinegars derived traditionally by fermentation (e.g. wine vinegars, cider vinegar, malt vinegar etc.) there's impurities that add various flavours, but vinegar is just acetic acid. You can go ahead and use acetic acid in the place of vinegar in your home cooking so long as you take into account the concentration... say you had 100% acetic acid (unlikely) then adding a spoonful of it would be like adding twenty spoonfuls of regular supermarket vinegar. You wouldn't want to drink it neat, but then you wouldn't want to drink 5% vinegar either, would you?

Incidentally, the popularity of "non brewed condiment" (5% acetic acid derived from a process other than fermentation) in the north of england is partly a result of the temperance movement in the 19th century. Apparently vinegar was too close to booze for some people(!) It was sold as "non-brewed vinegar" until a legal ruling in the mid 20th century forced the change.

Spirit vinegar or white vinegar is another type of vinegar that has been distilled (usually from malt vinegar because it's cheapest) to purify it. The result is something which is chemically identical to non-brewed condiment.

If you've not used spirit vinegar or non-brewed condiment in your cooking before, it's a very versatile ingredient which does not carry with it any fruit or malt flavours which can be inappropriate in certain applications.

Whitefiver

Please be VERY careful with concentrated Acetic acid. From what I recall, the burns are very painful, and not apparent for a couple of hours. Nasty stuff (in concentrate form).

Check here.

Regards,

White

Lois_Pallister

I have just discovered the amazing benefits of using vinegar along with other products (such as salt, bicarb of soda, epsom salts, soda crystals and essential oils to add perfume as well as other properties such as the wonderful antibacterial, antiseptic and anti-mould properties of Tea Tree Oil) to make my own cleaning products for the home. So far I have found them way more effective than shop bought chemical nightmares apart from being cheaper and greener to boot.

I have found a site that sells acetic acid concentrate that is 80% acetic acid. Therefore to get your usual 5% strength (of most distilled white vinegars) I will need to dilute it with 15 parts water! If I buy 5 litres of this product the resulting 5% solution comes to 21.5 pence per litre!!! Even cheaper than buying the vinegar in Tescos at something like 50 pence for half a litre!

I was concerned at how this 80% product was produced and what from and that is how I came across this thread. My concerns have been considerably allayed (especially considering that diluted acetic acid is even good enough for food products) although I still can't help wondering what makes up the other 20% in this product.

Having weighed up the pros and cons I have decided to go for it since as well as being so much more cost effective I am left with the option of (very carefully) using it at a higher conentration for cleaning as I see necessary. I intend to use it at 10% for general purpose cleaning as some vinegars are over this strength and so when diluted 50% with water for most cleaning jobs it will be like using full strength white vinegar and will cost me 43 pence per litre (still less than half price compared to buying it in the supermarket). And for getting rid of limescale in the toilet and round taps I may try to use stronger solutions (I live in London - hard water - nightmare).

I have never used white vinegar in cooking and have only ever used malt vinegar on chips every now and then (I don't often eat chips) and use far more expensive organic wine, cider and balsamic vinegars if I'm cooking with them but then so little is used and it keeps almost indefinitely and the main reason I try to save money in as many areas as I can and run two allotments is so that I can afford to eat organically.

I would however love to hear from anyone who can tell me how this 'concentrate' is manufactured and what the other 20% consists of if it is not just water. This will help to allay any remaining niggles regarding how green my house cleaning is.



p.s. I'm sure I'm way behind here but just incase there are any readers that do not yet know it is fantastic as a fabric conditioner (or rather water softener) in the washing machine especially with some essential oils added. I used 1/4 pint with 40 drops of lavender oil in the machine last night and my washing smells fantastic

Oh and baby wipes! Clean radiators and tile grouting and gloss paintwork etc like a dream and are the best thing I've found for cleaning the white plastic around the double glazing and can be bought for not much than 1 pence per wipe. I use a vinegar solution to wipe them down afterwards as they tend to leave surfaces with a matt finish otherwise but they make cleaning so easy. Next job is to find out if there are any nasties in those although I doubt it if they are ok for babies skin and then there is the green cost of their production but I'm going off topic now. sorry. Just so excited about it all.

celyn90

Most commerical acetic acid is manufactured industrially - I think, if I remember correctly a lot of it is manufactured by the carbonylation of methanol using a metal catalyst, but I have a feeling it is one of these things that can be produced from a variety of feedstocks (which makes sense chemically). The remaining 20 % is likely to be mainly water in your sample but there may be other stuff in there (should be stated on the label or on the MSDS form you will get with it!), it would otherwise be sold as "glacial" (neat or pure) acetic acid. It is almost certainly not food grade!

I would dilute it more than 50 % for cleaning, say to 10 % in water. Add it to the water rather than add the water to it IYSWIM.

It is corrosive - it still smarts if you get it on your skin at 80 % (trust me on this ). The main problem is that it smells horrendous - like vinger only a thousand times worse. I use it at work and don't handle it outside a ventilated cupboard because it smells vile. If you are going to dilute it, do it outside and store the bottle in the shed.