Lapland New Forest Scam. How to get money back...

Beki999

I went to LNF on 29th Nov, I paid £100 for my tickets, but cant claim through the bank as I used a pre-pay mastercard.

What should I be doing, I know to send the recorded delivery letter to the LL address, but then do I just sit and wait hoping that TS will refund monies in some fashion, some where down the line???

GomerPyle

The general consensus Beki999 is to make a claim anyway, detailing the circumstances, and mentioning the ongoing Investigations of the Trading Standards and possibility of legal action by them.

At this stage you are putting your foot in the door and making it clear you have a claim, however, or whoever you get repayment from.

There are no promises, but the alternative is to kiss goodbye to your money. If there is any justice or consumer protection in this country, then everyone will get their money back and part of the power is the weight of people requiring they get fair treatment.

I appreciate that some people may not want the hassle, and that's their choice. If and when your card provider turns you down that is not, I hope, going to be the end of the story.

I have just rung the FSA on 020 7066 1000 and I outlined the situation, and the reason for my calling. Apparently there wasn't an 'Investment Agent' available to speak to me, so I'll call back later or tomorrow.

Go away quietly - I won't. If they don't help, I got to the next authority higher up the ladder.

EdnaCloud

Beki999 wrote: »

I went to LNF on 29th Nov, I paid £100 for my tickets, but cant claim through the bank as I used a pre-pay mastercard.

What should I be doing, I know to send the recorded delivery letter to the LL address, but then do I just sit and wait hoping that TS will refund monies in some fashion, some where down the line???

The recorded delivery letter is a good idea as a back up, however I think that will not produce a result. There may well be other methods of recourse, and there is a considerable amount of work going on to assist in that, (see GomerPyle's recent posts). TS will not refund monies, you will have to take action yourself, but hopefully there is advice on this thread to help you.

We're sorry to hear about another sad loss of hard earned cash. :-(

EdnaCloud

GomerPyle wrote: »

I have just rung the FSA on 020 7066 1000 and I outlined the situation, and the reason for my calling. Apparently there wasn't an 'Investment Agent' available to speak to me, so I'll call back later or tomorrow.

Go away quietly - I won't. If they don't help, I got to the next authority higher up the ladder.

Fortunately, we have our own tenacious and persistent 'Investigation Agent' working on behalf of all those who have been ripped off, going by the name of GomerPyle. Good on you. Gomer, I'm sorry if my posts have duplicated, confused or contradicted you advice - so to all, I would defer to Gomer's advice and treat mine as peripheral collateral.

Best,
Edna

SeaSmart

Just called MINT. Spoke to a lovely lady who before i even stated what i was calling about said "This isn't lapland by any chance is it?"

Said she has had a few hundred and thats just her personally. Sounded genuinely sympathetic towards all the people who had been ripped off by the crooks.

Anyway she is sending me forms through the post for me to fill in. Will take it from there.

Sounds a bit more positive that the company is no longer trading and we didn;t even get a chance to go hence did not supply us with any goods at all.

GomerPyle

I got the impression that this situation wasn't unknown to the FSA.

The delay will be helpful as I can marshal my arguments and perhaps post them here in a non contentious form (me contentious ? - never) with supporting evidence.

It's using the forum as an aide memoire, but I believe it will show that this enterprise should have been quashed at inception and help me speak coherently when I finally make contact with someone at the FSA.

SeaSmart

Gomer you are a rottweiler.

Good on you keep up the great work.

codger

quote=Beki999;16596823]I went to LNF on 29th Nov, I paid £100 for my tickets, but cant claim through the bank as I used a pre-pay mastercard.

What should I be doing, I know to send the recorded delivery letter to the LL address, but then do I just sit and wait hoping that TS will refund monies in some fashion, some where down the line???[/quote]

Hi Beki. As Edna says, TS don't organise refunds. As to what you might usefully be doing now, read on. . .

Where refunds are concerned, Lapland NF has two categories of potential claimants, and it's as well for this crucial difference to be borne in mind:

Category 1: those who paid and visited the 'experience' and believe that on the basis of that experience, they were scammed

Category 2: those who paid but could not visit the 'experience' because it had closed down before their booking date.

Some Category 2 claimants should have a slightly easier time of this than others because non-provision of that which was paid for is a credit card Section 75 issue if £100 or more. If the amount is less than £100 then S75 won't kick in. That doesn't mean non-S75 claimants are not going to see a refund but it does mean the refund process is opaque: as I mentioned earlier, the payments would've gone to the company behind Lapland NF, not the "experience" organisers -- and it isn't clear, right now, where that money is.

For that reason, Lapland NF's payments processor -- accused by Lapland NF of, in effect, retaining some or all of the ticket income -- really could do with brushing up its corporate PR and issuing a statement about its position.

Such would be highly unusual, but then, this affair is highly unusual: either Streamline, the processor, did move in to freeze the Lapland NF account, or it didn't. If it didn't, then why did Lapland NF's website say so?

This particular aspect of the affair is of concern because TS doesn't have the same range of investigative powers as the police, and as yet I'm unaware of anyone connected with Lapland NF even being cautioned, let alone arrested.

Certainly, neither TS nor the police brought about the closure of Lapland NF (unlike Staffordshire TS, which did stop Lapland West Midlands from even opening.) But hopefully things are happening behind the scenes, including seizure of all company documents and liaison with Streamline (ironically, it's owned by RBS which in turn is, ironically, in large part owned by British taxpayers, people caught up in this scam.)

Category 1 claimants (paid-and-went) are in a much less secure position because their claim is based on an allegation that what they paid for, they didn't get. But that's actually the stuff of county court claims -- not criminal prosecutions. So the question still to be resolved here is yes, abundant evidence exists to indicate this was a scam, and people were scammed, but just where is that evidence to now be placed in pursuit of a refund claim?

If it's a criminal court, then such evidence would relate to a prosecution, the outcome of which isn't known. If it's a civil court -- with claimants looking at a minimum filing fee of around £30 -- then such action would be against the limited company set up to run Lapland New Forest. And whereas the decision of a criminal court can be carried through with no uncertainty, the outcome of a civil action is anything but: obtaining judgment is fine in theory but no use at all if, say, a limited company has gone bust.

That's why the status of the company (not the individuals) and the extent, the whereabouts and the "ownership" of the funds remains pivotal in this affair.

Whatever the state of play at the moment, the clock is certainly ticking loudly -- not for the victims / claimants, but for Trading Standards and Dorset police. Some news from them about their own intentions is needed sooner rather than later.

What I would suggest to people like Beki and any other paid-and-went claimants is that, as a matter of urgency, they go to their local Law Centre for a free legal consultation, or to their local Citizens' Advice.

Sitting around, waiting for news, does nothing for the nerves; far better to use the services of agencies which actually exist to deal with just this sort of eventuality.

(But of course, keep in touch with this thread; individuals like Gomer are chasing up ideas and hurtling along avenues the rest of us can't manage!)

Finally. . . for Something Completely Different!!

To pick up on a point Sandra made earlier in this thread about "being taken for a sucker". Sadly, that's happening all the time in the UK, and in every area -- including that which Beki touched upon: pre-paid MasterCards.

They're branded plastic issued by outfits which pay to licence MasterCard's name from Mastercard International Incorporated.

But because the cards are pre-paid, and therefore, no credit is involved, they're outside the Consumer Credit Act. So there's no Section 75 protection. The outfits flogging these pre-paid cards know that -- and hey, what an easy way to make a quick profit! Not only is there no credit risk, there's no Section 75 to worry about, either. Lubbly jubbly!

Moral: don't be taken for a sucker if considering a pre-paid MasterCard. Some Mastercard-branded pre-paid cards include purchase protection. A hell of a lot that don't -- no matter how fancy their ads, or how pretty-looking their card designs -- should be avoided.

trisontana

Even if the card companies pay the refunds it is still letting the scammers off the hook. Those payments have to come from somewhere. If it is from the card companies and banks then I bet they will pass this on all their customers in the form of increased charges or interest rates.

meggie2006

I have spoken to Barclaycard Mastercard today, and they are sending me out a form to complete. The lady I spoke to on the phone was very very helpful, and if advise it will take a while to process the claim and to hear anything back from Barclaycard, due to the shear volume of claims they had. She said nothing about it being under £100, ours only came to £90. At least I have started the ball rolling. Like everyone else at this time of year, really can't afford to write off the money

Good luck everyone with claiming