Consumer Rights: MoneySavingExpert.com discussion

Art_2

Elzo wrote:

Morning,
Don't know if you can help, not sure if this is a consumer issue as such...

Writing on behalf of my brother. He had an appointment at the dentist's a couple of weeks ago, and when he turned up for his appointment, 20 minutes beforehand as advised, the place was all shut up - doors locked, no sign, nothing. So he went home.

Phoned them the next day and the ratty receptionist answered (she is evil and everyone I know who goes to this particular dentist hates her!) She told him that the place had just been shut for lunch (ie, her lunch - she's the only receptionist) and before my brother could make another apppointment, he'd have to pay a £10 'no show' fine.

I think this is ridiculous as it is obviously a genuine mistake, just 'one of those things', and the receptionist should have put up a sign saying that it would be re-opening shortly. What was my brother to do, stand about in the rain for 20mins?

He wrote a letter of complaint to the dentist but it was the receptionist that opened it and obviously won't want to act on it. He phoned a few days later to check that the letter had been received and she knew all about it.

Does anyone know what we can do? I know its only £10 but its the principle and I don't think my brother is the one at fault. The way he is being treated is terrible.

Thanks for reading!

Were they open at the time of your appointment? If so you have no complaint. It was your decision to arrive early. Obviously, they could have been a little more customer friendly and put a note on the door.

Dentists aren't easy to find in some parts of the country so you have to either change dentists or pay up. Maybe when you eventually see the dentist face-to-face you can explain your concerns to him.

If you wish to complain officially you can do so to your local Primary Care Trust but I wonder if it's worth the hassle and at the end of the day you need a dentist and he may be your only choice.

Regards,
Art.

Toothsmith

I would have agreed 100% with Art, and say that everyone's entitled to a lunch break, and that if he turned up that early at about lunchtime, then he should have realized where everybody was.

But I re-read your bit about him being advised to turn up 20 mins early.

Was this in the form of a note on the appointment card?

If they put stuff like that on the stationary, then they should have some sort of explaination on the door when closed!

From their point of view though, he shouldn't have just abandoned, and should have been around at the actual appointment time.

If the practice is NHS and in England or Wales, then they are now specifically forbidden from fining patients for missing appointments.

The PCT might be interested if they are - but as Art said, it depends how easy it is to find another practice.

BTW, all practices should also have a published complaints proceedure, and MUST respond to all complaints with details of this proceedure within 14 days.

If that first response does not include a response to your specific complaint, then they have a further 10 working days to respond to your complaint and tell you what action they have taken.

Now, I doubt there will be much done, due to the fact that when it comes down to it, your brother was not there at the appointed time. But, legitamate complaints are that there should not be a fine, and if it says be there 20 mins early on the card, then there should be a staff member there to greet you.

If the complaint is not responded to, then a letter to the principal dentist marked 'Private & Confidential' should get through, and if still no joy, then again, a word with the PCT might be in order.

lfc84

Hello,

Hopefully you can offer some advice on this one.

I ordered an exercise bike online on Jan 16th which was delivered to the wrong address. The courier has confirmed the ship to address on the dispatch note was my house and its also on the order that I placed.

The courier did not call to say they would attempt delivery, so when they called at my house I was out. They left the bike at a house 8 doors away. This house was not the stated 'ship to' address. The courier did not leave a note saying that they had tried deliver the bike to me nor did they leave a note saying that thay had left the bike elsewhere.

At no time has the courier company contacted me.

I only know that they delivered it because i called the vendor and asked for the status of the delivery. They provided the consignment reference so i was able to trace it.

I called at the house 8 doors away today (25th) and they told me that someone had collected it on the evening of the 23rd. This person was not authorised by me to collect it and the person 8 houses away wasnt authorised to accept the goods. Neither did i ask the courier to leave it with anyone other than me.

So, evidently we neighbours dont know each other at all.....either the neighbour is pulling a fast one or someone watched the courier attempt delivery to my house and when they saw them deliver to the wrong house they chanced their luck later in the day...

I have complained verbally to the vendor who say this happens quite alot and will send me a replacement. I have complained to the courier, who whilst admitting they delivered to an incorrect address tell me i must take up the issue with the vendor (since the vendor will have an insurance for this type of event). I have also contacted my credit card company since i understand that they are jointly liable (under the terms of non-receipt of goods and due to the value).....

The vendor tell me they will process the shipment of a replacement tomorrow....

My concerns are:

- that this is all verbal with the vendor and courier
- what if they decide they dont believe me (even though the courier verbally admitted they delivered to different address)

who is ultimately to blame if i need to take this further (courier or vendor) ?

Thankyou.

Art_2

lfc84 wrote:

Hello,

Hopefully you can offer some advice on this one.

I ordered an exercise bike online on Jan 16th which was delivered to the wrong address. The courier has confirmed the ship to address on the dispatch note was my house and its also on the order that I placed.

The courier did not call to say they would attempt delivery, so when they called at my house I was out. They left the bike at a house 8 doors away. This house was not the stated 'ship to' address. The courier did not leave a note saying that they had tried deliver the bike to me nor did they leave a note saying that thay had left the bike elsewhere.

At no time has the courier company contacted me.

I only know that they delivered it because i called the vendor and asked for the status of the delivery. They provided the consignment reference so i was able to trace it.

I called at the house 8 doors away today (25th) and they told me that someone had collected it on the evening of the 23rd. This person was not authorised by me to collect it and the person 8 houses away wasnt authorised to accept the goods. Neither did i ask the courier to leave it with anyone other than me.

So, evidently we neighbours dont know each other at all.....either the neighbour is pulling a fast one or someone watched the courier attempt delivery to my house and when they saw them deliver to the wrong house they chanced their luck later in the day...

I have complained verbally to the vendor who say this happens quite alot and will send me a replacement. I have complained to the courier, who whilst admitting they delivered to an incorrect address tell me i must take up the issue with the vendor (since the vendor will have an insurance for this type of event). I have also contacted my credit card company since i understand that they are jointly liable (under the terms of non-receipt of goods and due to the value).....

The vendor tell me they will process the shipment of a replacement tomorrow....

My concerns are:

- that this is all verbal with the vendor and courier
- what if they decide they dont believe me (even though the courier verbally admitted they delivered to different address)

who is ultimately to blame if i need to take this further (courier or vendor) ?

Thankyou.

Your contract is with the vendor, not the courier. The courier is employed by the vendor. You must look to the vendor to remedy the situation.

If the vendor has promised to send another unit to you tomorrow I would wait to see if it arrives. If it does, you have your bike. Leave it to the vendor to deal with the courier.

If it doesn't arrive inform the vendor in writing that he is responsible to provide you with a replacement or refund your money. If he doesn't tell him that you will take him to the Small Caims Court.

So long as the bike was over £100 you are right to say your credit card company is jointly liable. Write to them to this effect and ask them to get involved.

Finally, make sure that the replacement when sent doesn't get delivered elsewhere again. Insist that the courier only delivers to the address as given. Ask the vendor for their contact number and talk to them to find out when they will call.

Regards,
Art.

Matty007

Dear Art

I hope that this is the right place to post this, if it is not then please advise where I might find some advice on this sight.

Whilst my Wife was studying at University, we successfully applied for a dependence grant amounting to £800.00.

Although all the paper work was filled in correctly by us, some months later we got a letter saying that they should not of paid this out to us and demanding we pay the money back.

Unfortuately the money had already been used and we had no inkling that this was money that should not of been given to us.

Now I am not in the business of using money from any source that is not my entitlement, and do not expect soemthing for nothing, however this was a debt we really were not expecting.

Are we soley responsible for the repayment or do they too have some liability to this overpayment ?

We have since paid back some £600.00 leaving a balance of £200+ outstanding.

I have always wondered whether my Wife really was legally obliged to pay this back as the mistake was undoubtedly by the company in the first place.

Just wondering.......

Art_2

Matty007 wrote:

Dear Art

I hope that this is the right place to post this, if it is not then please advise where I might find some advice on this sight.

Whilst my Wife was studying at University, we successfully applied for a dependence grant amounting to £800.00.

Although all the paper work was filled in correctly by us, some months later we got a letter saying that they should not of paid this out to us and demanding we pay the money back.

Unfortuately the money had already been used and we had no inkling that this was money that should not of been given to us.

Now I am not in the business of using money from any source that is not my entitlement, and do not expect soemthing for nothing, however this was a debt we really were not expecting.

Are we soley responsible for the repayment or do they too have some liability to this overpayment ?

We have since paid back some £600.00 leaving a balance of £200+ outstanding.

I have always wondered whether my Wife really was legally obliged to pay this back as the mistake was undoubtedly by the company in the first place.

Just wondering.......

Hi Matty,

I'm afraid that you are liable to pay back the money. Although they made the mistake they are entitled to bring it to your attention and ask for repayment.

The best you could have done was to have negotiated a settlement figure with them to take into account their error. The other thing was to arrange stage payments of the debt which it sounds like you have done.

Sorry I can't be more positive on this.

Regards,
Art.

Jess_E

Firstly, apologies as i posted this somewhere else... before i found this thread.

Hi, I bought a brand new car - Volkswagen Polo GTi - 6 months ago 18.07.06 and it keeps going wrong.
I have taken it back to VW for warranty work 4 times in the 6 months i have owned it. It was brand new when we got it off of the showroom floor and only had 3 miles on it.
Reasons i took it back and the problems:
1. Knocking noise coming from front near side - Anti-roll bar was loose
2. Tyres going down from day after i got the car - three 4" nails were in the 2 back tyres - Punctures, so new tyres paid for costing £249
3. Problems getting it into gear - Gear selector had snapped - replaced.
4. After picking it up from no.3, could not get it into 3rd gear atall - needed adjusting - was adjusted 5 times by master technician who still could not get it to "flow" into gear.
5. Wierd whining / rubbing noise when in reverse - currently waiting on "Technical Solution from Volkswagen Germany".
They had my car over xmas - from 19th December to 20th January and it is still not fixed. Germany have still not come through with a solution. I no longer want the car, dont trust it and am stuck with it for next 3 years on Volkswagen Solutions scheme... if it carries on at this rate i will be having to take it back 8 times a year! VW say they dont see the problem as they have fixed each fault (apart from the whiney noise). They offered us their GTi to drive around in for a week to assess if we felt there were any differences while they drove ours round. Theres not much difference and this car makes the dodgy noise in reverse aswell! They have said they will do a replacement for us and that we can keep this one they have given us to try out... for more money. Ours is an 06 reg, this new one is a 56 reg. It has 200 less miles on it than ours and is 2 months younger... When they had our car over xmas they racked up over 500 miles on our car (which i cannot prove but know) and if they hadnt done that, our car would be 2 months older but have less miles on it. It has the same packages as our one, no extras that we havent got. I do not want the car anymore, under consumer rights, can i get a refund? or maybe just a different car, say a standard Polo / Golf? We have a meeting tomorrow morning with the sales manager. We have spoken to Milton Keynes (head office for VW) and they say they cant help with this query and that we need to speak to sales manager.

Sorry for the long post... any more info needed, please let me know.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Am planning to go to CAB if tomorrow does not go as i would like.

Oh, and I Got it on finance. Part exchanged my Saxo VTR for £1300 and paid £700 deposit so in all, made £2000 deposit.

Art_2

Jess_E wrote:

Firstly, apologies as i posted this somewhere else... before i found this thread.

Hi, I bought a brand new car - Volkswagen Polo GTi - 6 months ago 18.07.06 and it keeps going wrong.
I have taken it back to VW for warranty work 4 times in the 6 months i have owned it. It was brand new when we got it off of the showroom floor and only had 3 miles on it.
Reasons i took it back and the problems:
1. Knocking noise coming from front near side - Anti-roll bar was loose
2. Tyres going down from day after i got the car - three 4" nails were in the 2 back tyres - Punctures, so new tyres paid for costing £249
3. Problems getting it into gear - Gear selector had snapped - replaced.
4. After picking it up from no.3, could not get it into 3rd gear atall - needed adjusting - was adjusted 5 times by master technician who still could not get it to "flow" into gear.
5. Wierd whining / rubbing noise when in reverse - currently waiting on "Technical Solution from Volkswagen Germany".
They had my car over xmas - from 19th December to 20th January and it is still not fixed. Germany have still not come through with a solution. I no longer want the car, dont trust it and am stuck with it for next 3 years on Volkswagen Solutions scheme... if it carries on at this rate i will be having to take it back 8 times a year! VW say they dont see the problem as they have fixed each fault (apart from the whiney noise). They offered us their GTi to drive around in for a week to assess if we felt there were any differences while they drove ours round. Theres not much difference and this car makes the dodgy noise in reverse aswell! They have said they will do a replacement for us and that we can keep this one they have given us to try out... for more money. Ours is an 06 reg, this new one is a 56 reg. It has 200 less miles on it than ours and is 2 months younger... When they had our car over xmas they racked up over 500 miles on our car (which i cannot prove but know) and if they hadnt done that, our car would be 2 months older but have less miles on it. It has the same packages as our one, no extras that we havent got. I do not want the car anymore, under consumer rights, can i get a refund? or maybe just a different car, say a standard Polo / Golf? We have a meeting tomorrow morning with the sales manager. We have spoken to Milton Keynes (head office for VW) and they say they cant help with this query and that we need to speak to sales manager.

Sorry for the long post... any more info needed, please let me know.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Am planning to go to CAB if tomorrow does not go as i would like.

Oh, and I Got it on finance. Part exchanged my Saxo VTR for £1300 and paid £700 deposit so in all, made £2000 deposit.

I can understand your concern on this one. You are of course covered by the Sale of Goods Act but car dealers are notorious for not replacing vehicles. They could also argue that the problems are 'minor' and you don't warrant a replacement.

See how your meeting goes but be very clear with the dealer that you want the car replaced and will take legal action if this is not done.

I am not a great advocate of CAB especially in a case like you have. It won't cost you anything to ask their advice though.

Are you a member of a motoring organisation or does your home insurance policy offer you any legal cover? I feel you are going to need some expert guidance on this one to reach a satisfactory solution. A report from a motoring engineer would tell you if a Small Claims Court action will be successful.

Put your complaints in writing and copy VW and the finance company. Leave them in no doubt that you will sue if things are not sorted.

Regards,
Art.

Jess_E

Art wrote:

I can understand your concern on this one. You are of course covered by the Sale of Goods Act but car dealers are notorious for not replacing vehicles. They could also argue that the problems are 'minor' and you don't warrant a replacement.

See how your meeting goes but be very clear with the dealer that you want the car replaced and will take legal action if this is not done.

I am not a great advocate of CAB especially in a case like you have. It won't cost you anything to ask their advice though.

Are you a member of a motoring organisation or does your home insurance policy offer you any legal cover? I feel you are going to need some expert guidance on this one to reach a satisfactory solution. A report from a motoring engineer would tell you if a Small Claims Court action will be successful.

Put your complaints in writing and copy VW and the finance company. Leave them in no doubt that you will sue if things are not sorted.

Regards,
Art.

I am not a member of a motoring organisation, and dont have any home insurance as I am living with parents.
Do you know how i would go about getting a report from a motoring engineer? It sounds expensive.

The sales manager has already said we can swap our car for theirs, but he wants more money.

Art_2

Jess_E wrote:

I am not a member of a motoring organisation, and dont have any home insurance as I am living with parents.
Do you know how i would go about getting a report from a motoring engineer? It sounds expensive.

The sales manager has already said we can swap our car for theirs, but he wants more money.

How about your motor insurance, does this give you any legal cover? It may be worth talking to your local Trading Standards office and asking their advice. They will also be able to point you in the direction of a motor engineer.

If all else fails you can always go straight to the Small Claims Court. It won't cost you a lot and you may get a result. I just feel you would be on firmer ground with some expert advice.


Regards,
Art.