Contaminated manure warning

ok_go

Hi all,

Well done for moving so quickly. I am looking forward to the iPM slot on radio 4 should be an intersting section. Don't worry about the fluffing they can do wonders with modern technology, I'm sure you'll come across as coherent...

Good news is I however that have managed to source some manure from a friend who has only one souce of straw (which she has cleared as being pesticide free) and the rest of the time the horse grazes in her own field which has nothing added to it.

So Im gonna make poo while the sun shines

Regards

Go

Larumbelle

RAS wrote: »

Silver

Thanks for doing all this. I am one of the lucky ones. Bought manure last spring and I was alright. Had enough over for this year. But many of my fellow plotters have been devastated, in some instances using manure bought from the same source later on last year.

I am one of the lucky ones too, thank goodness. But some of the stories I have been hearing are awful. One person who lost at least 15 years work breeding dahlias, one who grew almost all of her family's food on her plot and had no idea how she was going to feed them, entire allotment sites literally poisoned. It's terrible, and the worst thing is that even if aminopyralid is never used again, the problem is likely to persist until at least 2012. Oh, and if aminopyralid is banned permanently it is likely that some of its place will be taken by two other chemicals, clopyralid and picloram, which cause exactly the same problems. I'm not letting that happen if I can help it Luckily lots of us have decided the same thing!

RAS wrote: »

No-one will now buy manure from the same source.

Had an interesting conversation with the NFU at a show. When I pointed out that that farmer was going to be faced with a major disposal problem as no-one would buy his manure now, the guy went Oh sh****.

I reckon he was making about £2500 from our site alone, so he is also going to take a huge hit on his income.

It really makes me laugh. They just don't see the problem - yet. At the moment we are just a bunch of allotmenteers stirring up trouble. Give it a few years, when they have not only lost part of their income, but are having to pay to have the manure removed too, and I think they'll start to see how serious this is for them, as well as us. The Soil Association are on our side, because a fair few organic growers have been hit.
Most farmers are innocent parties themselves: some have contaminated land through supplied manure the same as us (potato growers had the first inkling that any of this was happening); some have inadvertantly acquired then supplied affected manure and have lost their reputations (and could face legal action) and many, many farmers will struggle to get rid of perfectly good manure now, and will have to pay for disposal. Commercial manure merchants are now demanding that farmers prepare an affidavit, at their own expense, stating that their manure is aminopyralid-free. There are comparitively few villains in the farming community, and yet their union, who is supposed to look after their interests, has gone into defence mode as some kind of knee-jerk reaction. So I get hate mail from farmers when really they could be doing something constructive, and when they really should be on the same side as us. One of the emails said I was 'just another stupid ****ing pig ignorant turkey voting for Christmas, as usual'. Personally, I think it's the other way round.

RAS wrote: »

One thing that does concern me about testing is that when i walked round our site, the effect was very patchy. So there could be a patch of potatoes, with those in one area looking OK and then a swathe through the middle of itwhere the plants were some of the most distorted I have seen. It was as if some of the manure was OK and then there was a section that was badly contaminated, so when it was forked out the effect was uneven.

I agree with you that the best testing we have at the moment is far from perfect. But the alternative right now is cowboys (who I'm not naming, but do a google and you'll find them) charging up to £180 plus vat per sample (remember you need multiple ones) to do exactly the same thing as the method we are recommending; i.e plant something in a sample and see what happens. We are looking into gas chromatography as the only other viable test, but it is horrifyingly expensive (unless we can find an ally to do it for us) and the only real benefit is that it can tell us exactly which chemical caused the problem. It suffers the same problem as testing at home, in that you can only test small samples from dispersed areas. After all, aminopyralid is designed to work in minute quantities. 5ml would be enough to devastate your average allotment plot, but the one good thing about it (and I'm being relative here) is that it doesn't seem to migrate. Obviously you can't test everything, so right now all you can do is test the worst affected bits, but pass on to your fellow allotment holders to PLEASE do it yourself and don't pay a vulture to do it for you!

Ok go, thankyou, please don't mention it if I sound like a stuttering moron. I'll just deny that it was even me anyway :rotfl:
It's good that you've got a secure supply, I hope the sun shone for you today! You made me laugh even though I didn't think I had much to laugh about. One good thing about this is the never-ending capacity for poo jokes!

SKIPPY54

Hi,Just to let every one know, this is not the only country with the problem,AMINOPYRALID is marketed all over the world.

I have family in Austrlia where it is marketed as HOT SHOT.
A cousin who is very political is now on the trail with a freind who does work for FREINDS OF THE EARTH.

If you have family or freinds abroad let them know and get them to get organised and fight to have this stuff banned across world.

If you are old enough to remember DDT we have the same threats by it!.
Dont let the THIRD WORLD become a dumping ground for it either

Get your MP involved,if you dont know who he or she is there is a link back on this thread.

Larumbelle

They ran the piece - it was the first item! :j

Podcast available here if you missed it: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/podcasts/ipm/

~Chameleon~

I listened to most of it but missed the first few minutes as I was reading something on here and didn't realise it had started already

Just downloading podcast to listen again

Larumbelle

Bump bump bumpedy bump!

RAS

Hi

It is on the 5.30pm PM broadcast on i-player. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00cwxmd/

irishwexford

We were affected by this with our potatoes although when we dug them up they appeared ok so we ate them.Our parish council own our allotments and they have announced that they have contacted the H.C. society and also the farmer asking him to state what he put in. We will be contacted shortly when they have his reply, he is denying any blame at present. We still have some manure sittinng on allotment ready to put down in winter. Thought perhaps this may ok now, if not really do not know what to do with it. We were only affected with the potatoes as we put chicken manure of rest of plot and have bumper crop

Mini_JK

irish: It may not be straight forward for your farmer to actually know what went into his manure, I know of cases where farmers have used spraying contractors on their grassland (who never told the farmer what type of spray they were using or the consequences), also your farmer may have bought iin some hay from another farmer who might have used aminopyralid but didn't pass on the warning, or the farmer may have treated his land with manure from another farmer, etc, etc - you get the idea.

Don't use your manure pile unless you are 100% sure its clean. Remember that if you do have this particular weedkiller in your manure it doesn't start to break down until the plant material has rotted and it's incorporated into soil - so even if you left it until next year you might still get the problem.

RAS

Irish

Some of our plot holder have problems this year with manure they bought and stacked last year.

And as Mini said, the chemical could come

1. From spraying of the farmer's land.
2. from siliage or hay they they bought in
3. From straw that they bought in and used for bedding
4. From extra grazing bought on land they do not own.
5. Possibly from manure brought in and spread on their land.

that is just what I can think of.

Added to which this chemical is sold under about 8 different names in the UK.