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  • FIRST POST
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 1st Jul 17, 10:46 AM
    • 709Posts
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    Inigo Montoya
    Cancelled adele concert tickets issue
    • #1
    • 1st Jul 17, 10:46 AM
    Cancelled adele concert tickets issue 1st Jul 17 at 10:46 AM
    I sold a couple of adele concert tickets back in december 2016 (over 180 days ago) by paypal

    the concert has just been cancelled so I told the buyer I would refund if the concert wasnt rescheduled

    the buyer has said she wants a refund even if the concert is rescheduled but Im not sure I want to agree to that if I cant get a refund myself for those ticket from the distributor

    if she doesnt like this answer is there a way she can still open a credit card dispute so I end up with a paypal chargeback problem ?
    - apparently normally its a 180 days limit but ive read on the internet that people appear to have been subject to them after this limit

    If she manages to do a credit card chargeback will my paypal account be deducted or will her own account go negative instead ?

    She cant open a standard paypal dispute as its more than 180 days

    hopefully the concert wont be rescheduled so this issue will disappear
    Last edited by Inigo Montoya; 01-07-2017 at 10:49 AM.
Page 1
    • Tealblue
    • By Tealblue 1st Jul 17, 10:54 AM
    • 660 Posts
    • 1,023 Thanks
    Tealblue
    • #2
    • 1st Jul 17, 10:54 AM
    • #2
    • 1st Jul 17, 10:54 AM
    You're entitled to a refund whether or not the concert is rescheduled. See http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/can-i-get-a-refund-on-my-ticket
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 1st Jul 17, 11:03 AM
    • 709 Posts
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    Inigo Montoya
    • #3
    • 1st Jul 17, 11:03 AM
    • #3
    • 1st Jul 17, 11:03 AM
    thats good to hear

    also having just read this
    http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/guides/article-2523075/What-Christmas-purchases-wrong-How-chargeback-help-money-back.html

    it says a buyer can file a CC chargeback up to 120 days after the actual date of the event and not the date of the transaction
    Last edited by Inigo Montoya; 01-07-2017 at 11:06 AM.
    • MrJones1
    • By MrJones1 1st Jul 17, 4:00 PM
    • 116 Posts
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    MrJones1
    • #4
    • 1st Jul 17, 4:00 PM
    • #4
    • 1st Jul 17, 4:00 PM
    In this case the buyer has stated that she wants a refund even if the concert is rescheduled. She should get a refund. I don't think that it will be a problem for you. Most ticket sellers for big gigs are members of the Society of Ticket Agents and Retailers. It means that they have to follow its code of practice. If a gig is cancelled or rescheduled, you are entitled to a full refund. The refund however doesn't extend to lost travel costs or rearranging the travel.
    • theonlywayisup
    • By theonlywayisup 3rd Jul 17, 4:09 PM
    • 11,178 Posts
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    theonlywayisup
    • #5
    • 3rd Jul 17, 4:09 PM
    • #5
    • 3rd Jul 17, 4:09 PM
    The buyer may be able to open a dispute. Paypal's buyer protection has a caveat for Event tickets, which although woolly does give a buyer some help.

    13.11 Event tickets

    In certain cases, if you purchase a ticket or pay for the right to attend an event from a Payment Recipient who is a UK registered PayPal Account holder (“Event”), all monies paid by you may be held by PayPal on trust for you, so that the beneficial interest in such monies remains with you until the performance of the Event in question.
    Ultimately it is not the fault of the buyer that the event has been cancelled, in her/his shoes I would also prefer to have a full refund. What is to say she keeps the ticket, the event is rescheduled but as the original purchaser you claim a refund. She may turn up to the event with an invalid ticket.

    Refund. You won't want a chargeback on your account, they come with a £14 fee and they may also retain your Paypal fees.

    What platform did you use to sell them?
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 4th Jul 17, 11:30 AM
    • 709 Posts
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    Inigo Montoya
    • #6
    • 4th Jul 17, 11:30 AM
    • #6
    • 4th Jul 17, 11:30 AM
    I will be refunding the buyer (the event isnt being rescheduled)

    However Paypal will take their pound of flesh from me as they remove the 'issue refund' button after 180 days so there is no way to claim their not insignificant fees back

    Furthermore the buyer will also get charged paypal fees on the refund I send unless I use send money to friends/family or dont use paypal - however if i do that it leaves me vulnerable because should the buyer do a CC chargeback as well then I end up refunding twice & fees on top

    There is still potential for dispute with the buyer as I do not intend to refund the £6.45 cost of posting the tickets by special delivery as this was an optional cost - I offered posting or free collection from me on the event day - i do not think this is unreasonable but no doubt there will be people who will say I should refund that too

    Hopefully when I explain to the buyer that I have non refundable paypal fees to pay & that Im prepared to pay them in a way that means they dont incur paypal fees themselves they will accept the £6.45 amoutn I wont be refunding

    I sold the tickets on gumtree

    thank you very much adele - please mime next time & save me the headache
    Last edited by Inigo Montoya; 04-07-2017 at 11:49 AM.
    • theonlywayisup
    • By theonlywayisup 4th Jul 17, 3:49 PM
    • 11,178 Posts
    • 7,486 Thanks
    theonlywayisup
    • #7
    • 4th Jul 17, 3:49 PM
    • #7
    • 4th Jul 17, 3:49 PM
    I will be refunding the buyer (the event isnt being rescheduled)

    However Paypal will take their pound of flesh from me as they remove the 'issue refund' button after 180 days so there is no way to claim their not insignificant fees back

    Furthermore the buyer will also get charged paypal fees on the refund I send unless I use send money to friends/family or dont use paypal - however if i do that it leaves me vulnerable because should the buyer do a CC chargeback as well then I end up refunding twice & fees on top

    There is still potential for dispute with the buyer as I do not intend to refund the £6.45 cost of posting the tickets by special delivery as this was an optional cost - I offered posting or free collection from me on the event day - i do not think this is unreasonable but no doubt there will be people who will say I should refund that too

    Hopefully when I explain to the buyer that I have non refundable paypal fees to pay & that Im prepared to pay them in a way that means they dont incur paypal fees themselves they will accept the £6.45 amoutn I wont be refunding

    I sold the tickets on gumtree

    thank you very much adele - please mime next time & save me the headache
    Originally posted by Inigo Montoya
    If you ring Paypal, they will be able to refund through the original transaction for you. They will also sort out the fees if you do it this way and you won't be out of pocket other than the 20p transaction fee.

    Personally I think you should suggest splitting the Special Delivery fee.
    • highnal
    • By highnal 6th Jul 17, 10:15 AM
    • 51 Posts
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    highnal
    • #8
    • 6th Jul 17, 10:15 AM
    • #8
    • 6th Jul 17, 10:15 AM
    Just had my confirmation from Eventim on my Adele tickets refund.

    Booking fee isn't included in the refund.

    £6.50 per ticket! Ridiculous.
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 6th Jul 17, 10:22 AM
    • 709 Posts
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    Inigo Montoya
    • #9
    • 6th Jul 17, 10:22 AM
    • #9
    • 6th Jul 17, 10:22 AM
    Just had my confirmation from Eventim on my Adele tickets refund.

    Booking fee isn't included in the refund.

    £6.50 per ticket! Ridiculous.
    Originally posted by highnal
    Was half expecting they would not refund the booking & delivery fee - for me its a total of £34

    i will attempt a visa chargeback if I get that too

    not acceptable IMO

    I suspect there will be some small print somewhere that gives them the 'right' not to refudnthe booking fee but thats an unfair contract clause IMO

    there are going to be 100s of thousands of unhappy ticket buyers
    Last edited by Inigo Montoya; 06-07-2017 at 10:38 AM.
    • countingbeans
    • By countingbeans 6th Jul 17, 11:10 AM
    • 4 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    countingbeans
    I agree - I am awaiting my refund for these tickets from Songkick - I've checked their T&C's and it says refund will include booking fee but not delivery - I can live with this as this was £2.50

    However looking at Eventim's T&C's - they say they will refund ticket cost only and not booking fee. Totally agree that this doesn't seem fair at all; especially given it is such a high proportion of the ticket price!
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 6th Jul 17, 11:14 AM
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    • 651 Thanks
    Inigo Montoya
    I agree - I am awaiting my refund for these tickets from Songkick - I've checked their T&C's and it says refund will include booking fee but not delivery - I can live with this as this was £2.50

    However looking at Eventim's T&C's - they say they will refund ticket cost only and not booking fee. Totally agree that this doesn't seem fair at all; especially given it is such a high proportion of the ticket price!
    Originally posted by countingbeans

    mine were from songkick too so thats a relief - can live with the £4 delivery charge
    • highnal
    • By highnal 6th Jul 17, 11:58 AM
    • 51 Posts
    • 2,067 Thanks
    highnal
    However looking at Eventim's T&C's - they say they will refund ticket cost only and not booking fee. Totally agree that this doesn't seem fair at all; especially given it is such a high proportion of the ticket price!
    Originally posted by countingbeans
    Well that's poo!
    When the refund comes through, I'll raise a dispute through my credit card provider to try and get the booking fees back that way.
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 6th Jul 17, 12:56 PM
    • 15,324 Posts
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    pinkshoes
    Surely they can just refund the whole amount and charge Adele for any losses?
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 7th Jul 17, 10:19 PM
    • 709 Posts
    • 651 Thanks
    Inigo Montoya
    I agree - I am awaiting my refund for these tickets from Songkick - I've checked their T&C's and it says refund will include booking fee but not delivery - I can live with this as this was £2.50

    However looking at Eventim's T&C's - they say they will refund ticket cost only and not booking fee. Totally agree that this doesn't seem fair at all; especially given it is such a high proportion of the ticket price!
    Originally posted by countingbeans
    songkick sent me an email today confirming this
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 14th Jul 17, 1:14 PM
    • 709 Posts
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    Inigo Montoya
    not had my refund come through yet or even an email confirming it - apparently was due to be sent by today but can take a few days to show up

    all booking fees are being refunded now BTW eg
    http://metro.co.uk/2017/07/07/adele-ticket-agency-backtracks-and-offers-full-refunds-after-furious-fan-reaction-6762729/
    • countingbeans
    • By countingbeans 14th Jul 17, 2:19 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    countingbeans
    I've had my email from Songkick on the 7th but still waiting for the refund to appear on my credit card.....

    Glad to see that Eventim changed their stance on the booking fees!
    • Inigo Montoya
    • By Inigo Montoya 19th Jul 17, 2:49 PM
    • 709 Posts
    • 651 Thanks
    Inigo Montoya
    If you ring Paypal, they will be able to refund through the original transaction for you. They will also sort out the fees if you do it this way and you won't be out of pocket other than the 20p transaction fee.
    Originally posted by theonlywayisup
    phoned paypal who were helpful & didnt just say I had to send a new payment as I was half expecting

    they tried to manually refund the payment but apparently the system simply wouldnt allow it due to the 180 days limit - so basically looks like there is absolutely no way round this

    instead they did the next best thing which was to credit the fee on the original payment to my account & then ask me to send a personal fee free payment to the buyer

    not ideal as 'in theory' the buyer can still attempt a visa chargeback on their original payment even after my refund
    Last edited by Inigo Montoya; 19-07-2017 at 2:57 PM.
    • ballisticbrian
    • By ballisticbrian 19th Jul 17, 3:22 PM
    • 3,144 Posts
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    ballisticbrian
    Could Adele... "Remedy" the situation. ; ) She was busy "Chasing Payments"...
    Warning: any unnecessary disclaimers appearing under my posts do not bear any connection with reality, either intended, accidental or otherwise. Your statutory rights are not affected.
    • nomoneytoday
    • By nomoneytoday 24th Jul 17, 2:45 PM
    • 4,718 Posts
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    nomoneytoday
    I do like it when ticket touts end up out of pocket


    The number of tickets being resold makes it harder for genuine fans to see the artists, and I applaud the work of acts like Ed Sheeran where the venue only allows named people in.
    • COOLTRIKERCHICK
    • By COOLTRIKERCHICK 25th Jul 17, 9:22 AM
    • 10,403 Posts
    • 58,259 Thanks
    COOLTRIKERCHICK
    I do like it when ticket touts end up out of pocket


    The number of tickets being resold makes it harder for genuine fans to see the artists, and I applaud the work of acts like Ed Sheeran where the venue only allows named people in.
    Originally posted by nomoneytoday
    Also it's not only good for trying to stop ticket touts. It's also good for security and in an event of a fire or a freak/extreme disaster then there is a record of who is at the venue.
    Work to live= not live to work
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