Unenforceability & Template Letters III

Just thought it's time to clear up any confusion as to the terminology "Sign Digitally". At the base of each and every template you'll see the footnote below:

Yours faithfully



Sign digitally

Now, it may seem a daft question, but what do I mean by sign digitally? Ok, the one thing a lender needs to enforce a debt is your signature. If you took a card out with them 10 years ago, it's unlikely they will have the original and so will send you an unsigned CCA - they then try and hide behind OFT guidance surrounding a "True Copy" - we can beat this each and every time.

However, to enforce a debt in court the lender requires an original document, original meaning it can be a scanned printed copy - but must be the same one that was issued at the time of the card, with your signature. Usually what happened was you'd sign an agreement and return it, the bank would have already had a copy of the CCA and this is the version they stored, not your signed copy (this went to archive).

So, the moment you request a CCA and sign it, the lender can then use NEW OFT guidance regarding a reconstituted copy. This allows them to create the original document using cut/paste etc - however they will cut your signature and paste it onto the document proving it to be valid, unless you can prove they cheated this way (almost impossible).

Therefore the flaws of signing are abundantly clear. You are giving the lender a reason to create a new document, sign it and present it to the court.

Sooo, what does "sign digitally" really mean then, to avoid this from happening?

It simply means copy the template onto your word processing package and then overwrite the red text with your name, as examples below point out: so the above, in my case would change to: If for any reason the lender does copy/paste your signature onto a document that say, you know you never signed then you can send back one of the following templates, in response:

1. CCA Query - Copy Document Supplied
2. CCA Dispute - Forged Document Supplied

But the OFT also made it clear that it was unfair to say they have an original if they do not; see quote below:

The OFT goes on to advise that lenders would be acting unfairly, and potentially in breach of their consumer credit licenses, if they misled borrowers by:

• hiding or disguising the fact that there was never a proper signed agreement in the first place

Therefore, we can get them to prove, by a sworn statement, whether they had the original or made a recon - if they admit (pre court) that they made a recon then we win. If they say they have the original, they win (cos they probably do!).

jinny wrote: »

Hi NID just lost a long post with my list of creditors, sorry its taken so long to get back from Friday but as you said you dont want to take this lightly. My debts are not as much as some peoples on here but I have had them a long time and am retiring age this year although I am not getting the payment untill early next year. Im staying on as long as my owld bones will let me though. I will post the list of creditors in my next post as i dont want to risk having to type them out again. The thing that worries me is I am on the morgage with my son, but he pays it, so I dont want to stuff his chances of remorgaging in the future with more defaults, I intend to look for my own rented place as well soon so hope that would not impact either. See what you think anyway ta in advance.

MSE times out if no activity after a few minutes so always best to right click, select all, copy before you click submit. That way if it logs you out, you have the message stored ready to right click and paste when you've logged in again.

I lost loads of the templates when I first started doing them due to this, it drove me up the bloody wall :rotfl: :rotfl:

regards to the financial link with your son, the moment the house is sold any assiociation (financial link) held with the credit agencies, would be broken thus releiving him of any adverse as a result of sharing the house with you. To be honest, the defaults are not his, you're his mum and he will be able to add a notice on his credit file explaining he does not have a financial link with you, only a mortgage. That is quite normal.

Rainbow_Liberty wrote: »

OMG OMG OMG I can't believe I've got it so wrong and possibly F****d everything up for myself now. I want to be sick

Calm down, i'll sort it for you ok. Just wait and see what they send back. I didn't mean to freak you out, but you do need to pay ultra attention and anything you're unsure of - ask me, please? that's why i'm here and I am here, daily - most the day.

Just calm down and don't worry. Its fixable.