Help enforcing CCJ

mimi1234 · 24 January 2017 at 11:00AM

Hi all,

Just a quick question in case any of you have experience of this.

I made an investment which has now ended but I have only been returned some of the money. I made a claim via money claim online and have a CCJ against the person I invested with.

The amount he owes is just north of £10K with fees and interest on top.

Before the CCJ came through, he sent me an income and expenditure sheet which shows most of his assets are via finance. For instance, he has a very snazzy car, worth over £30K easily but he has said it is on finance.

I am going to call the bailiffs office next month as I cannot wait any longer to get the money back.

My question is this, say for instance most of his possessions are on finance, what happens if the bailiff only siezes items worth £2K or £3K. What happens after that? Is there any other way I could get my money back? I have read about putting a charge on his property but I don't quite understand it. Does anyone have any experience?

I tried to get some advice off CAB but they said as the process had already started, they were unable to help me.

Thanks to anyone who might be able to help, and sorry if I sound really stupid. I will definitely not be investing any of my money ever again!

alltaken · 24 January 2017 at 11:26AM

Does the debtor look as though bankruptcy is becoming a possibility or are you looking at the possibility of making the debtor bankrupt?

If not then I believe you're in the wrong section - I'm sure sourcrates or a mod will move you to the right section shortly.

mimi1234 · 24 January 2017 at 1:36PM

Oh dear. Have I posted in the wrong section?

Can the moderators please put in the right please if that is the case.

I am not sure about the bankruptcy situation of the debtor. Sorry.

MEM62 · 24 January 2017 at 2:25PM

Any assets on finance cannot be seized because he does not own them - the finance companies do. Unless he has assets that are clear of finance that can be sold at auction the bailiffs have little or no leverage to enforce collection of your money.

MrsTinks · 24 January 2017 at 3:26PM

So in answer to the whole "what do I do if there isn't enough assets - you can absolutely return to court and seek a charging order. Once this is granted you can then apply to force the sale of the house. There ARE some instances where you can't force the sale - instead of repeating the whole thing here this is a good read: Charging order

I don't know if an attachment of earnings is a possibility, but it may be worth looking at

poppasmurf_bewdley · 24 January 2017 at 4:18PM

MEM62 wrote: »

Any assets on finance cannot be seized because he does not own them - the finance companies do. Unless he has assets that are clear of finance that can be sold at auction the bailiffs have little or no leverage to enforce collection of your money.

Only items that are on Hire Purchase cannot be seized.

Any item that is on finance but not subject to a HP agreement, and therefore not secured, is able to be taken by the bailiffs. For instance, if a bank loan has been obtained to buy the car, it will still be on finance but could be seized.

You will need to obtain an HPI check on the car to ascertain the status of the car.

National_Debtline · 24 January 2017 at 7:15PM

Hi mimi1234,

This guide from the court can gives some information about your enforcement choices (from part 12 onwards) - https://formfinder.hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/ex350-eng.pdf. The court issues a lot of guides like this to help people understand how a judgement can be enforced, the different processes and what each type of action means. You could ask the court to send these to you if you are struggling to find the information online.

You may also want to take further legal advice about enforcement, because it is a bit of double edged sword. Applying for enforcement action can cost you money as the claimant and if you were to enforce the judgment inappropriately you may be no closer to getting your money back.

For example, if you were to apply to bankrupt someone, you will have to pay the bankruptcy costs and if this application was successful you would be treated the same as any other creditor, you won't go to the top of the list of people to be repaid just because you applied for the bankruptcy. In fact, if the person has other debts, who are larger than yours, they may get paid before you. And if the person has limited or no assets that can be sold as part of the bankruptcy you may not get your money back at all.

Laura
@natdebtline

fatbelly · 24 January 2017 at 7:32PM

mimi1234 wrote: »

I tried to get some advice off CAB but they said as the process had already started, they were unable to help me.

This is not true - we are able to advise on the options for enforcing a ccj.

It is advisernet 4.32.3.0

The options are

•warrant of control (bailiffs), aimed at the debtor's goods
•attachment of earnings, aimed at a debtor's earnings
•third party debt orders, aimed usually at money that the debtor holds in a bank or building society
•charging order, aimed at a debtor's property
•making the debtor bankrupt, aimed at any assets owned by the debtor.

In order to determine which option will be most affective (and these can be used in certain combinations) you may want to consider an 'Order to obtain information from a judgment debtor' which forces him to attend court and complete a detailed form. Failure to comply is one of very few things in the world of debt that you can be jailed for.

The info is written up on the public site from the debtor's perspective

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/action-your-creditor-can-take/

mimi1234 · 3 February 2017 at 3:34PM

Thanks for the replies all.

Since I posted this, I made one last attempt to contact him and ask for the money back. The response I received had "already on a debt management plan", "have heaps of debts to pay off", "you took out a CCJ so I can't apply for a loan", "I'm expecting a few big investments coming up and I can then pay you off".

He is giving me enough money each month to cover the interest which is about £100 since I applied for CCJ. In the response I received from him, he supposedly spoke to the courts and they said that he could give me £100 a month and it would all be good. I never accepted this offer and he never explained this to me. All I see if £100 in my account every month.

I've had a look at the various links you kind folk have posted but my brain is now completely frazzled. Is the income and expenditure sheet he sent me the same as an attachment of earnings (or whatever it is called, the thing where it is done in court)?

He runs a very successful estate agency so I can't for the live of me understand why he has so much debt? Also, if someone was on a debt management plan and the car was very expensive, would they not advise him to get a bog standard car instead of one that roars and speeds around?

Are there any agencies or anyone I could speak to about this without being charged? I know going back and forth to my solicitor is going to increase the fees more and more and I am beginning to wonder if I should just wave goodbye to the money he owes me based on the amount of people he owes and the number of debts he has?

steampowered · 3 February 2017 at 4:00PM

If you don't think this person is being truthful, I personally would just go ahead and engage bailiffs (HCEOs).

There is no guarantee of success but it sounds like your best option. Let the bailiffs try and see what assets they can get their hands on, particularly that snazzy car.

Other options include seeking an attachment of earnings (if he is employed), seeking a charging order over his house (if he owns property), or making him attend court for questioning about what assets he owns.

In the response I received from him, he supposedly spoke to the courts and they said that he could give me £100 a month and it would all be good.

As I'm sure you already suspect, this is a complete fib. That isn't how the courts work.

I know going back and forth to my solicitor is going to increase the fees more

There is no need to involve your solicitor with using bailiffs. As you have a CCJ any HCEO firm is able to assist you from here.

I've had a look at the various links you kind folk have posted but my brain is now completely frazzled. Is the income and expenditure sheet he sent me the same as an attachment of earnings (or whatever it is called, the thing where it is done in court)?

No, it isn't. If he wants to ask the court to set payments he would need to make a formal application for that. The form looks like this: https://formfinder.hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/n245-eng.pdf

fatbelly · 3 February 2017 at 5:18PM

Hi

I can't add much to my previous post as all the options are set out there.

He's giving you £100 per month which is good. But it will take over 100 months to repay you and this could stop at any time.

He's given you an income/expenditure statement - does that justify the £100 per month as his only spare money? Are there any other clues that could help you, like does it say mortgage or rent; does he pay car finance? Is there anything obviously false on there?

When an estate agent talks about cashing investments, I am guessing that means property. Any way you can find out if he owns anywhere? You can of course find this out through an order to obtain information, but there is an up-front cost to that.

If you can find a property that he owns (and a £3 Land Registry search will confirm) then you can do a charging order - then when it sells you get your money.

Most people now think 'HCEO warrant of control' due to the wonderful marketing campaigns that the BBC and other channels lay on free for them. But if the flashy car is on HP and he won't let them in to where he lives, then they are neutered (but you don't see that on The Sheriffs are Coming)

Help enforcing CCJ

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