cyclist deaths & the law
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Strider590 wrote: »Are you suggesting they don't brake? Of the collision videos i've seen, the cyclist did actually brake in each instance. I mean they're gonna be doing what 30mph on a road bike, 20 on a hybrid? It's no different to the speed a car would be doing.....
...but their brakes are often no way near as effective as car brakes, especially downhill...so they shouldn't be travelling at anything like the same speed.
I agree that in most clips the cyclists brake once it's evident the car's turning/braking/accelerating/otherwise going to smack into them...But often simply too late. When they see a car coming towards them turning right, why aren't they thinking "there are 1000 clips on youtube of people in this situation...the car always turns across them and they get hit....could I stop if he did that now? maybe I should slow so I could..."
Instead they just seem to think "I've right of way, if they hit me it's their fault" and charge onwards. Weird.0 -
Found this:-
http://www.exploratorium.edu/cycling/brakes2.html
No idea how accurate either the maths or the concept are, but it suggests a stopping distance in the dry of 8ft at 15mph, 15ft at 20mph and 34ft at 30mph.
Sounds plausible.0 -
Well as most of the clips on you tube seem to portray cyclists who simply go out to seek confrontations with motorists (even those who make the smallest mistake), I couldn't agree more.
Look at the clip below for example. The car driver 'obey's' the cyclist but and yields at the pinch point still gets 'advice'. In fact this particular poster is exactly what i'm talking about.
http://youtu.be/LJ7n7ez3fBk
Well I admit I am not shy on passing on my thoughts to drivers,cyclists and pedestrians as required
I had one bint do an undertake then pull right back in front of me the other day.
of course I easily caught her at the next set of lights.
I asked her if my life was worth that manoeuvre
her answer
do you pay road tax....................0 -
Well I admit I am not shy on passing on my thoughts to drivers,cyclists and pedestrians as required
I had one bint do an undertake then pull right back in front of me the other day.
of course I easily caught her at the next set of lights.
I asked her if my life was worth that manoeuvre
her answer
do you pay road tax....................
And of course your reply was,
"No, and neither do you, you pay Vehicle Excise Duty, which is based on the emissions of your vehicle and bears no relation to your use of the road network"0 -
absolutely not. This is just blame shaming - "hmm, cyclist seem to be getting killed a lot - lets train them some more"
when was the last time a cyclist ran into a car and killed or injured the car driver...hmm practically never? even the cyclist / cyclist or cyclist / pedestrian interface is practically unheard of.
it's the other way around - driver education - that they don't own the road, that there are vulnerable road users out there for whom they have a duty of care and that they need to just share the damned road a bit better.
its in the drivers interest to do this also - as every cyclist on the road is probably one less car on the morning commute.
No, but I can get on a bike without learning the highway code and do what I want on the roads. I drive a car and I ride a motorbike and some of the stunts I have seen cyclists pull amaze me! going through red lights, wrong lane on roundabouts, cutting lanes without indicating - nearly got one the other day going cutting from the inside lane to turn right on a roundabout without indicating and then he screamed at me when I nearly hit him! there should be some form of training for cyclists to be on the road - similar to the CBT for motorbikes. it isnt always the drivers fault!!!0 -
absolutely not. This is just blame shaming - "hmm, cyclist seem to be getting killed a lot - lets train them some more"
when was the last time a cyclist ran into a car and killed or injured the car driver...hmm practically never? even the cyclist / cyclist or cyclist / pedestrian interface is practically unheard of.
it's the other way around - driver education - that they don't own the road, that there are vulnerable road users out there for whom they have a duty of care and that they need to just share the damned road a bit better.
its in the drivers interest to do this also - as every cyclist on the road is probably one less car on the morning commute.
This is completely the wrong attitude, and is exactly what is causing the problem. You cannot change the basic physics of the road situation. Cars are big and heavy and drivers sit in relative safety inside them. Bikes and cyclists not so much.
Instead of complaining about driver behaviour - most of which will inevitably go unpunished even in the event of an accident - cyclists need to re-learn to cycle defensively.
It's the only way to make progress on this, IMHO.0 -
Cornucopia wrote: »cyclists need to re-learn to cycle defensively.
It's the only way to make progress on this, IMHO.
That's what usually gets them into hot water with drivers........
For example taking primary position to stop drivers squeezing them at pinch points and to avoid "door zones". That vast majority of abuse against cyclists comes down to drivers not understanding when cyclists are riding defensively, rather than riding to p*ss everyone off.“I may not agree with you, but I will defend to the death your right to make an a** of yourself.”
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Perhaps I need to refine terms - riding defensively, in my mind, is about safety, not about antagonising other road users.0
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No, but I can get on a bike without learning the highway code and do what I want on the roads. I drive a car and I ride a motorbike and some of the stunts I have seen cyclists pull amaze me! going through red lights, wrong lane on roundabouts, cutting lanes without indicating - nearly got one the other day going cutting from the inside lane to turn right on a roundabout without indicating and then he screamed at me when I nearly hit him! there should be some form of training for cyclists to be on the road - similar to the CBT for motorbikes. it isnt always the drivers fault!!!
You could also insert car,bus,taxi,motorbike,lorry infront of that statement for most road users experiences0 -
Cornucopia wrote: »Perhaps I need to refine terms - riding defensively, in my mind, is about safety, not about antagonising other road users.
Exactly as I mentioned, it's about safety, but drivers take it the wrong way...... The fact is, you can't cycle in a door zone, whether there is a cycle lane or not, if someone opens a door your history. You have to take control at pinch points or your inviting some idiot to squeeze through.
Drivers don't see the danger, they just see a cyclist being an annoying c**t.
The problem really is that 80%+ of drivers don't plan ahead, they don't see the queue, they don't see the red lights, they just go into "must get in front of cyclist" mode.“I may not agree with you, but I will defend to the death your right to make an a** of yourself.”
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