Changes To StayWarm

djohn2002uk · 20 August 2005 at 10:11PM

panther wrote:

I visited my elderly parents and they are worried about a recent letter from Staywarm. Apart from the monthly price increase to £71.75, Staywarm also say my parents use too much energy for the number of people in the home (2 people living in a 3 bed bungalow).

Staywarm have given a consumption summary for the last 12 months @:
Elec: 3,584.64 kWh
Gas: 54,264.78 kWh

According to the Ofgem definition of a high user that Martin posted, it appears my parents are within the elec limits of 4,950 but have exceeded the gas limit of 28,000. We don't understand how the gas can be almost double the limits as they have been with Staywarm for 3 or 4 years with no previous warnings of high use. The only gas consumed is for central heating which is off most of the summer months? I'm wondering if there has been a mix up with the meter readings because I don't understand how they can exceed by almost double!

You need to check your parents meter. They did this with me with figures very similar to your parents. I realised that they were using the readings and converting them to KWh as if we had an imperial meter when in fact it was a Metric one. This gives a gas usage of roughly 2.5 times the actual figure and they wouldn't listen untill I got Energy Watch involved. I'm now happy with Scottish Power and £200 a year better off.
P.S. They wanted a final bill payment after transferring me to their standard tariff of £107 which was changed to a refund of £8.

panther · 20 August 2005 at 11:14PM

Thanks for that, I will check it out tomorrow - I take it there will be something to identify a metric or imperial meter?
Unfortunately I don't think they have any past meter readings handy which would help me calculate roughly the kwh used - but I will make a note of the present readings and again in a week/month to calculate usage and will phone Staywarm on Monday and ask for previous years usage figures as it should more or less be the same each year.

P.S, Until I understand how to calculate gas readings, does anyone know roughly the average price of 54,264.78 kWh units of gas if on a standard tariff? That might give some idea if Stayworm figures are grossly wrong.

djohn2002uk · 21 August 2005 at 12:36AM

Converting Units to Kilowatt Hours
Electricity consumption is usually already stated in kilowatt-hours on previous bills, so the electricity kWh's figure is ready to use. (What you read from the meter is in Kilowatt Hours)

Gas units need to be multiplied by 31.3 to convert from the units used according to the meter or bill, to kilowatt-hours. Then the gas kWh's are ready to use. This is a rough estimate and the exact conversion details are below. (Or, for rough figures, multiply by 100, then divide by 3).

(To convert gas units to kilowatt hours: gas units used x imperial to metric conversion factor (2.83) x volume conversion factor (1.022640) x calorific value (39.7) divided by kilowatt hour conversion factor (3.6) = kilowatt hours used.)( This is the same as: gas units used x 31.3 = kilowatt hours used).

If you have a metric meter, you do not need to use the imperial to metric conversion factor (2.83). In this case, the rough estimate is to multiply the metric units by 11 instead of 31.3.

To tell if your meter is imperial or metric. If it has dials it's imperial. If anywhere on the face it says Cubic Feet or Feet with a small 3 near the top of the t, again it's imperial. If it says Cubic Metres or M with a little 3 near the top it's metric. (I don't know how to write cubic metres on here)

panther · 21 August 2005 at 1:12PM

Thanks again djohn, some useful info there. Luckily my parents have kept previous British Gas quarterly statements for the years 1995 to 2000 and I am now beginning to think that Staywarm figure of 54,264.78 kWh may well be correct. According to the BG statements they were averaging a yearly figure of between 40 to 45,000kWh and since being on Staywarm they have kept the heating on all night during the colder winter spell so I think their figure is correct. The Staywarm yearly consumption figures should be more or less the same each year so I don't understand why after 4 years they now decide to say too much is been used - unless Staywarm have lowered their own acceptable consumption limits or are becoming more strict in enforcing it.

Analysing the British Gas quarterly figures it shows that most of the consumption (around 30,000kWh) is used during the months of November to March and around 10 to 15,000kWh during the rest of the year. I will have a look into the loft & cavity wall insulation that Staywarm can provide.

panther · 22 August 2005 at 2:49PM

Spoke to Staywarm and they're going to arrange a visit from an advisor to discuss ways to save energy. They would not tell me what KWh Staywarm regard as a high user except to say that it is higher than Ofgem figures. They did tell me the Calorific Value so anyone who wants to work out their own KWh the CV to use is 39.4.

chommin · 30 August 2005 at 7:07AM

staywarm is directed to pensioners on 1 or more benifits
many such vulnerable elderly people do NOT have either a computer or access to one
how does such a group currently find out if powergens staywarm is still right for them?

Cardew · 30 August 2005 at 9:38AM

panther wrote:

I visited my elderly parents and they are worried about a recent letter from Staywarm. Apart from the monthly price increase to £71.75, Staywarm also say my parents use too much energy for the number of people in the home (2 people living in a 3 bed bungalow).

Staywarm have given a consumption summary for the last 12 months @:
Elec: 3,584.64 kWh
Gas: 54,264.78 kWh

P.S, Until I understand how to calculate gas readings, does anyone know roughly the average price of 54,264.78 kWh units of gas if on a standard tariff?

Using your figures above, if on BG dual-fuel(paid by direct debit iand n the Midlands - tariffs vary across the country) they would pay approx £242 for electricity and £974 for gas. A total of £1,236

So even on £71.75 monthly(£861) Staywarm is a considerable saving.

Whilst accepting bungalows always have higher heating costs than comparable 2 storey houses, over 54,000kWh does seem a huge consumption of gas for 2 people. There is a thread on this forum about average consumption of gas & electricity and few people approach that useage.

margaretclare · 30 August 2005 at 9:47AM

panther wrote:

Thanks again djohn, some useful info there. Luckily my parents have kept previous British Gas quarterly statements for the years 1995 to 2000 and I am now beginning to think that Staywarm figure of 54,264.78 kWh may well be correct. According to the BG statements they were averaging a yearly figure of between 40 to 45,000kWh and since being on Staywarm they have kept the heating on all night during the colder winter spell so I think their figure is correct. The Staywarm yearly consumption figures should be more or less the same each year so I don't understand why after 4 years they now decide to say too much is been used - unless Staywarm have lowered their own acceptable consumption limits or are becoming more strict in enforcing it.

Analysing the British Gas quarterly figures it shows that most of the consumption (around 30,000kWh) is used during the months of November to March and around 10 to 15,000kWh during the rest of the year. I will have a look into the loft & cavity wall insulation that Staywarm can provide.

Hi

We are a couple aged 70 and we have a 2-bedroom bungalow in south Essex which is very well-insulated (the first thing that my late first husband did when we moved here 15 years ago!)

This little house stays cool in hot weather and warm in cold weather. We've never needed to have the heating on all night, and only on the few coldest days last winter did we use the gas-fire as well as central heating. The gas we used for heating last winter was 8027.7 kWh 22nd November to 7th February. The previous quarter, 10th August to 22nd November, was 5234.5 kWh. This is from Atlantic Electric & Gas and we're paying £28 a month by direct debit. We pay £20 a month to GreenEnergy for electricity, cooking, washer, fridge-freezer all 'A' rated.

There are grants available for insulation if you're on a low income, and from experience I would say that insulation is absolutely crucial.

HTH

Margaret

Graham1 · 1 September 2005 at 11:34PM

If anyone is interested - the Scottish and Southern Energy Group (SWALEC, Southern Electric, Scottish Hydro Electric) do tell you what is the maximum annual consumption they allow on their easywarm tariff (their equivalent of staywarm) - this limit is 96,000 Kwh for electric and gas combined for a 3 bedroom property.

sallysaver · 25 September 2005 at 8:44PM

Graham,
Can you give any idea what the monthly payment is for a 3 bedroom property with Swalec is please? I'm currently with Staywarm and would welcome the opportunity to make a comparison. I have looked on their website without success. Thank you

Changes To StayWarm

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