Education Maintenance Allowance - exceptions

Pont

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

The information on the EMA website is very clear that it's the specific date of birth that counts and not the term dates. It also emphasises the fact that it is the individual and not the year group that counts and is absolutely clear that someone who is studying in the year ahead of their age group will not be eligible. I don't think that this is a loophole as it's an eventuality that has been considered and a decision has been made to cover it. I'm sure it's very annoying but I can't see you getting any further. Sorry.

Yep - I'd agree that is the information in all of the EMA literature/web pages etc. But, I have a letter from a senior LSC manager stating DD 'is too young by 3 days as her birthday is 3 days after the county's academic year start date of 2nd September' (note no mention of 31st August cut off date - no longer seems to apply). Well this is all fine and dandy until I checked the September term date and found that it is in fact 8th September. Of course this means that DD, according to the LSC manager, is 3 days within their stated rulings.

I'd still ask if anyone out there has any experience of this - thanks.

Oldernotwiser

Pont wrote: »

Snap!!! I was a FE lecturer too - my college certainly didn't start back that early but I've been delving about on the web and found quite a few examples. Can't list them all but see below.

http://www.stokesfc.ac.uk/st/term_dates

Thank God I got out in time!

Pont

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

Thank God I got out in time!

Lol - me too! :eek:

SuziQ

Pont,something I remeber from when my daughter stated 6th form 2 years ago is that her first day (enrollment) was actually in August (the 31st that year) and then the term actually started later. Is there anything like that in your DD's case that you could use to make her eligible? I really feel for you on this-getting EMA made a huge difference to my DD and has also helped her get to grips with budgeting etc,feeling independent-I really hope you are able to sort this.

Pont

SuziQ wrote: »

Pont,something I remeber from when my daughter stated 6th form 2 years ago is that her first day (enrollment) was actually in August (the 31st that year) and then the term actually started later. Is there anything like that in your DD's case that you could use to make her eligible? I really feel for you on this-getting EMA made a huge difference to my DD and has also helped her get to grips with budgeting etc,feeling independent-I really hope you are able to sort this.

SuziQ - this is the info I'm looking for, so many thanks! If you have the actual start date of learning that would be of particular help together with the name of your authority. I of course won't pass on personal details, at this point I just need some 'hearsay' examples. All I'm asking for is the same level playing field for DD that every other student is afforded.

At present the official (published!) cut off date for EMA is 31st August which is supposed to coincide with school leaving dates. However, in the small print of the Education Act it states that school leaving dates are dependent on school/college starting dates (confusing or what?). My point is that school/college starting dates are different from year to year, and also to compound matters from authority to authority,and also from institution to institution within the different authorities! This is where the problem lies - in essence there is no official leaving date throughout the country because there is no official starting date. The situation is that a child can be declined EMA by one authority but if they applied for EMA in a neighbouring authority it would be fine due simply to their academic year start dates. As I stated to the LSC it is a postcode lottery.

What I have been told up to now is:-
a) Your daughter has completed her compulsory education - that's fine.
b) Your daughter has been accepted at a college of FE to start her A levels - great.
c) Your daughter wishes to apply for EMA as she has met the previous qualifying criteria - Oh dear, we haven't come up against this before - she's too young!!

I'm saying how can she fulfil one part of your rulings but not be eligible for the follow up part - it isn't rocket science surely!

I'm being told that this doesn't occur, and of course I'm saying this is occurring in my DD's case. I'm pushing the case that my DD is within 3 days of the start of term - therefore she is 16 at the start of the academic year. There seems to be a 'black hole' for kids who are falling between leaving dates and EMA applicable dates. I honestly think they haven't taken this anomoly into account, and in all likelihood it hasn't occurred before.

I also think that top public servants, on salaries of K100+ per year really should have crossed their 'T's and dotted their 'I's!!!!

Any other examples out there - I'm depending on you all!

Oldernotwiser

Pont wrote: »

SuziQ - this is the info I'm looking for, so many thanks! If you have the actual start date of learning that would be of particular help together with the name of your authority. I of course won't pass on personal details, at this point I just need some 'hearsay' examples. All I'm asking for is the same level playing field for DD that every other student is afforded.

At present the official (published!) cut off date for EMA is 31st August which is supposed to coincide with school leaving dates. However, in the small print of the Education Act it states that school leaving dates are dependent on school/college starting dates (confusing or what?). My point is that school/college starting dates are different from year to year, and also to compound matters from authority to authority,and also from institution to institution within the different authorities! This is where the problem lies - in essence there is no official leaving date throughout the country because there is no official starting date. The situation is that a child can be declined EMA by one authority but if they applied for EMA in a neighbouring authority it would be fine due simply to their academic year start dates. As I stated to the LSC it is a postcode lottery.

What I have been told up to now is:-
a) Your daughter has completed her compulsory education - that's fine.
b) Your daughter has been accepted at a college of FE to start her A levels - great.
c) Your daughter wishes to apply for EMA as she has met the previous qualifying criteria - Oh dear, we haven't come up against this before - she's too young!!

I'm saying how can she fulfil one part of your rulings but not be eligible for the follow up part - it isn't rocket science surely!

I'm being told that this doesn't occur, and of course I'm saying this is occurring in my DD's case. I'm pushing the case that my DD is within 3 days of the start of term - therefore she is 16 at the start of the academic year. There seems to be a 'black hole' for kids who are falling between leaving dates and EMA applicable dates. I honestly think they haven't taken this anomoly into account, and in all likelihood it hasn't occurred before.

I also think that top public servants, on salaries of K100+ per year really should have crossed their 'T's and dotted their 'I's!!!!

Any other examples out there - I'm depending on you all!

But I really think that the information about children studying in the year ahead of their age does cover your situation exactly. I think that all this business of start dates etc. just complicates things; the facts are really clear for your daughter's situation. She just falls the wrong side of the cutoff date.

Pont

I take on board your point, however the counterview is that if the start date is after DD's birthday then she wasn't studying a year ahead, she was in the correct year group. I feel this as already been accepted as there is now no argument that she shouldn't be leaving school.

kimmoss88

I don't have any advice for you but good luck with this case. EMA really helped me through college.

Surfbabe

Jsut thought I'd add my two penn'th. My DS got through 6th form without EMA and my DD is doing the same. We jointly earn slightly too much for them to claim but our disposable income is a lot less than some of their peers parents who do get it!!!! There has to be cut of dates and amounts somewhere along the line, but I do think it is a very unfair system. It is advertised as helping tennagers study so they don;t have to worry about working whilst doing so - we are in a very rural area and so there are very few jobs for teenagers.

MrsE_2

I don't know much about the EMA (my DD didn't get it either - despite all her friends getting it!).

But if she doesn't get it this year, surely she will get it next year?
Are they allowed one or two years of it?
She will still get that won't she, just that it will start a year later.

My DD got the ALG in her last year at college (I think they launched it in her last year - but I could be wrong), thats means tested on the students income.