HBOS shares

setmefree

Mr_Mumble wrote: »

HBOS are the second largest BTL mortgage lender. They're falling today on the back of Bradford & Bingley's troubles (B&B being the largest BTL lender).

Oh right, so their last months performance must have been a trial run

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/fds/hi/business/market_data/shares/3/23174/one_month.stm
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

setmefree

Shares now @ 352.25 :eek:

noddy321

setmefree wrote: »

Shares now @ 352.25 :eek:

I think shares are best avoided. I also think there should be more regulation when it comes to the buying of shares. 2 years ago I received £140K from the sale of my house. I opened an online trading account with a bank and invested £10K in shares. The bank then gave me a personal trading level of an extra £10K, as I bought and sold more shares they kept increasing my level so eventually it had increased from 10K to 320K. As my shares kept dropping I felt that I had the money to keep buying more shares to try and get my money back. I feel these banks should be far more responsible in the limits they give people. I have now lost £110K. I know that I have been very foolish but I also feel that had the bank stuck with the trading limit of £10K I would of never lost such a huge sum of money. This has caused me so much stress and worry over the past 2 years. It's a bit like a bank crediting your account with 320K and asking you not to spend a penny of it - they should not do it in the first place. When I filled in my online application form I told them that I only worked part-time and had an income of £5K per year. Let this be a warning to any other novice investors.

dunstonh

I think shares are best avoided. I also think there should be more regulation when it comes to the buying of shares.

Regulation on shares is actually satisfactory.

I opened an online trading account with a bank and invested £10K in shares. The bank then gave me a personal trading level of an extra £10K, as I bought and sold more shares they kept increasing my level so eventually it had increased from 10K to 320K.

So you chose to open the trading account and act without any advice.

As my shares kept dropping I felt that I had the money to keep buying more shares to try and get my money back.

More decisions made by you.

I feel these banks should be far more responsible in the limits they give people.

The bank didnt do anything you didnt ask them to do. You could have employed a stockbroker if you wanted advice and guidance but you decided to cut that cost out and do it yourself.

I have now lost £110K.

What the heck were you doing? late 2007/early 2008 wasnt the best of times (but no means the worse. We are only down around 13% (FTSE) from the high point and thats nothing. Most people investing in shares at that time would be break even or losses of no more than 20%.

I know that I have been very foolish but I also feel that had the bank stuck with the trading limit of £10K I would of never lost such a huge sum of money.

The bank is not there to take responsbility for your lack of self control.

Let this be a warning to any other novice investors.

Doesnt sound like you did much investing at all. More like gambling and punts. The lesson should be that DIY is not suitable for people that dont have a clue what they are doing. Not having a clue is not something you should be ashamed of but you should be aware of your limitations.

noddy321

dunstonh wrote: »

Regulation on shares is actually satisfactory.



So you chose to open the trading account and act without any advice.



More decisions made by you.



The bank didnt do anything you didnt ask them to do. You could have employed a stockbroker if you wanted advice and guidance but you decided to cut that cost out and do it yourself.



What the heck were you doing? late 2007/early 2008 wasnt the best of times (but no means the worse. We are only down around 13% (FTSE) from the high point and thats nothing. Most people investing in shares at that time would be break even or losses of no more than 20%.



The bank is not there to take responsbility for your lack of self control.



Doesnt sound like you did much investing at all. More like gambling and punts. The lesson should be that DIY is not suitable for people that dont have a clue what they are doing. Not having a clue is not something you should be ashamed of but you should be aware of your limitations.

Well thanks for that it makes me feel a whole lot better!. You say that the bank didnt do anything that I didnt ask them to do. I did not ask them for a 320K trading limit. I put 21,000K in Northern Rock, I had shares in RBS and HBOS (where I paid around £9.00 a share), shares in Standard Life and several others which have nose dived. Yes I have been very, very stupid but I cannot turn the clock back. I see you live in Norfolk the same as me, wish I had met you 2 years ago.

noddy321

noddy321 wrote: »

Well thanks for that it makes me feel a whole lot better!. You say that the bank didnt do anything that I didnt ask them to do. I did not ask them for a 320K trading limit. I put 21,000K in Northern Rock, I had shares in RBS and HBOS (where I paid around £9.00 a share), shares in Standard Life and several others which have nose dived. Yes I have been very, very stupid but I cannot turn the clock back.
When a bank gives you a 320K limit you feel that they must have confidence in your investing or they would not allow you to have such a large limit. I spend up to that limit at it's cost me dearly. The 1st year I made £20K, but then they kept upping the limit and I bought more shares (mostly in banks) and that's why I have lost so much money.
Can I have a hug now - I need one.
PS I live in Norfolk too.

esbo

noddy321 wrote: »

I think shares are best avoided. I also think there should be more regulation when it comes to the buying of shares. 2 years ago I received £140K from the sale of my house. I opened an online trading account with a bank and invested £10K in shares. The bank then gave me a personal trading level of an extra £10K, as I bought and sold more shares they kept increasing my level so eventually it had increased from 10K to 320K. As my shares kept dropping I felt that I had the money to keep buying more shares to try and get my money back. I feel these banks should be far more responsible in the limits they give people. I have now lost £110K. I know that I have been very foolish but I also feel that had the bank stuck with the trading limit of £10K I would of never lost such a huge sum of money. This has caused me so much stress and worry over the past 2 years. It's a bit like a bank crediting your account with 320K and asking you not to spend a penny of it - they should not do it in the first place. When I filled in my online application form I told them that I only worked part-time and had an income of £5K per year. Let this be a warning to any other novice investors.

Sorry to hear your story. it does seem the bank encouraged you to trade with more than you initially intended, presumable they knew you have more then £10,000 available, it does seem like they were encouraging you to 'gamble a bit more' as time went buy, of course they make money whether you win or lose so it is no loss to them.
Share trading is gambling really, but there is no regulation on it, I doubt they would have lent you so much if they stood to lose money. It does not even sound as if you were investing in high risk companies either, I mean you expect banks to be relatively safe.
I got some free shares with HBOS, I sold 38% at about £9 but I still have the rest, how I wish I had sold the lot! As for taking the advice of a stockbroker well I expect he would have told you to put your money somewhere safe, like banks!! It does seem to bank encouraged you to get out of your depth, they were not concerned about you losing money at all, their only concern was that they would get their money back, perhaps they should have said that on the appllication form so they did not give the impression that they being responsibe on your behalf.

Yes banks should be more responsible with their limits, the only 'responsibility' they showed was to themselves. If I were you I would take your bank account to a more responsible bank, if there is such a thing.

dunstonh

. It does not even sound as if you were investing in high risk companies either, I mean you expect banks to be relatively safe.

The bank provided an execution only service. They cannot provide advice or guidance on execution only. If we didnt have execution only then those who want to do DIY investing would pay a lot more.

DIY is not suitable for inexperienced investors. One of the most common things you hear from people who say not to invest in the stockmarket is that they lost money and would never invest in the stockmarket again. When you actually find out what they invested in, it was far too high risk for their risk profile and they usually dont understand how investments work. Risk is not on/off. Its a sliding scale. To lose that amount in that period (which is basically a break even to small loss period suggests very very high risk. That is not the bank's fault.

esbo

dunstonh wrote: »

The bank provided an execution only service. They cannot provide advice or guidance on execution only. If we didnt have execution only then those who want to do DIY investing would pay a lot more.

DIY is not suitable for inexperienced investors. One of the most common things you hear from people who say not to invest in the stockmarket is that they lost money and would never invest in the stockmarket again. When you actually find out what they invested in, it was far too high risk for their risk profile and they usually dont understand how investments work. Risk is not on/off. Its a sliding scale. To lose that amount in that period (which is basically a break even to small loss period suggests very very high risk. That is not the bank's fault.

However it is not just execution only, they are offering loans to people who never
even requested them, infact actually giving them a credit facility they never even asked for, that is not a very admmirable practice.
Not too many people would call some of Englands biggest banks risky, after all these are companies regulated by the government and who should have some of the finest financial mind in the country running them, either that or a bunch of ex-public schoolboys anyway.
He didn't say which bank he banks with, however I expect there is a 50/50 chance that it will be going down the sh*tter too.
You seem to be under the impression the 'experienced' would have investors done better, if so perhaps you can tell us where most peoples pension funds have disappeared too?
Also I note you are an 'independant' financial advisor so you are not likely to have an independant view on these matters as you make a living giving 'financial advice'.

dunstonh

However it is not just execution only, they are offering loans to people who never
even requested them

No-one says that option had to be taken. Some may find it useful whilst trades are being settled. Others not. However, the choice to use it or not remains with the individual.

You seem to be under the impression the 'experienced' would have investors done better

Yes. An experienced investor knows the risks and looks at reward potential. It doesnt mean they wont make losses but they will know what they are investing in and if they can handle it or not.

if so perhaps you can tell us where most peoples pension funds have disappeared too?

Most people's pensions have not disappeared. A very small vocal minority have had issues with certain defined benefit schemes but they are not investment linked like personal pensions, stakeholders, SIPPs and other money purchase schemes which account for the majority of pensions out there.

Also I note you are an 'independant' financial advisor so you are not likely to have an independant view on these matters as you make a living giving 'financial advice'.

What has being an IFA got to do with stockbrokering and DIY buying of shares?

I suggest before you make such daft accusations, you lurk a bit longer before deciding what biases may or may not exist. You may also want to check your facts at the same time as you seem to have a distorted view of reality.