OH MY, The Most Stunning Beautiful Property

m00m00

prices will certainly go lower, the issue is how much lower
what is clear is that they are VERY unlikely to increase in the next year or two

adding to your savings is the best course of action in the current situation.

Doozergirl

You ask too many questions for this time at night!

PasturesNew

Re chippy. Go when they've been open a few hours, check for extractor fans round the back. Find out the prevailing wind direction. Check the wind direction on the day you go. Open the windows and have a damned good sniff.

Last thing you need is finding out that they timed your viewings for when the chippy was shut. Or that usually the prevailing wind is in the other direction and you have to live with chip smells.

Captain_Mainwaring_2

matt99b wrote: »

Thanks for all the advice everyyone, it's been quite helpful!

And to captain and few others in minority trolling this thread, please leave, I don't expect to read words like pu55y on a board like this and I'm not going to respond further to your comments.

We went to see the flat from the outside and area today again, and think we're going to consider putting an offer in.

By the way ground rent and nominal charges we've been told are about £50 a month.

Are offers bound- or can we pull out any time if we learn something new?

Does anyone have any advice on what we should do for an offer? Here is what we have so far:

- If you accept our offer it is on the condition that the property be taken off the market
- our offer includes the SOF (OR our offer includes a full lease extension)

The asking price is "offers in the region of 170,000" - if anyone has any ideas what would make a sensible offer including the above, that would be appreciated

One thing that does still puzzle us about leaseholds. If you can purchase a lease extension before the property gets below 70 years for almost free, then why do some people let their leases run down to zero? Considering the low cost of lease extensions, surely everyone would have just purchased extensions so that the property value doesn't go down? I know of a property that got down to 2 years on the lease, and the leaseholder is desparately trying to sell for less than 30% the property's normal value. And I know of a few others too. If it's so easy to get a lease extension then why don't/didn't they do it?

thanks for all the help everyone

It's true little boy, the fur really did fall out of their cat.

Anyhow leasehold is immoral.

You will have absolutely no trouble getting 125% mortgage for the property so go ahead and put a 10% non-refundable deposit down and don't worry about the lease, the freeholder has to extend it for £2-50.

As for the chippy, what a piece of luck !! you can arrange some sort of system where you can let them know your order and then you can open the window and they can put the chips in a bucket which you can winch up.

If you buy a diesel car with an inline pump you will be able to use the chip fat to run your car for nearly nothing, though make sure you strain any odd bit of fish out as they can block the exhaust.
I must say you are quick off the mark and you have spotted the chip shop below the neighbours, most people would never have realised.


You go from the sublime to the ridiculous - leases are an instrument of the devil and should be outlawed, but a virtually unmortgageable flat over a chippy is absolutely spiffing.

You can discuss the issue of the morality of leasehold with the crowd of hooded herberts who hang around at 11pm throwing buttered baps and empty drinks cans at your windows.

Yep, you have all the answers.

SingleSue

patchwork_cat wrote: »

To the OP it is unhelpful to think what 170K would have bought 20 years ago - do I hear a hint of a parent speak there? On average the price of goods doubles in 10 years ( note goods not property) so something that costs 170K today would have cost 42.5K 20 years ago and that is not even property! Wages were a fraction of todays 20 years ago an EO in the civil service earned 7.5K what would they be on today 25- 30K? more than 3 times the salary 20 years ago.
OK I take it back be as mean as you like captain.

You clearly do not understand what leasehold is. Look why attack people- just pull out if you aren't hapy and don't moan because your expectations are realistic.

Blimey, I really was on a good wage back then! Mind you, the same job now pays the same salary I was on back then.

gfplux

Hello matt99b,
I have not read all 4 pages of this thread as handbags were being thrown. However if these points have been considered ignore me.
As far as I know all flats in London are leasehold. That may apply to the whole UK.
Until a few years ago it was almost impossible to get an extension of your lease but a change in the law fixed that. Now the freeholder must allow the purchase of the freehold and the price is some multiple of the ground rent give or take a few pounds.
I owned a flat in N20 a few years ago. It was in a block of 12 flats and when I bought it the 12 owners had previously joined forces, formed a company and bought the freehold. I bought a leasehold flat (with 80+/- years to go) and a one twelfth share in the company that had been formed to own the freehold. Rules and changes were then agreed in a democratic fashion with each flat owner having one vote. We had lots of fun when it came to agreeing the colour to re-paint the common parts and other life changing decisions like how much to give the bin men at Christmas. ha ha ha.
Around that time I had considered a flat above a shop, great price and great location. These were in the days of "normal mortgages" and my "normal" building society at the time advised against it (but would have lent me the money if I insisted)
You may find that if you are able to buy the freehold it will have to be jointly with a number of other people and your objectives are not the same as the owner of a chippy or a newsagent.
By the way I think negotiating a lease extension is not rocket science but it takes time. If you decide to go ahead, buy the flat then extend the lease yourself, but check if it can be done as every situation can be different.

Lakey

OP you say several times that you are worried about... believe me these are alarm bells ringing so beware. The fish and chip shop, seems ok now whilst you are in lust with your property, wait for a few years and it will be a weight around your neck. If it makes you think twice, how do you think you will be able to sell on? You say there are problems for obtaining a mortgage over commercial premises, you seem to be lucky having an offer, but what will happen when you want to sell on?
It seems that your emotions are taking over from your sense, so stop and think before you make a big mistake.
Remember location,location,location.

LillyJ

barring ridiculous salaries above 60k

Over 60k isn't ridiculous. What a sweeping generalisation. OH and I earn 60k a year between us and he has only A levels (no degree) and is a copper.
We are 23 and 24. By next year taking into account annual pay rises for years in service, that will tip us over 60k. I don't think we are ridiculous at all.

I imagine there are many other people on here who earn over 60k joint, and others who earn that or a lot more alone. (neverdespairgirl and her partner being one such couple who spring to mind).

neverdespairgirl

LillyJ wrote: »

I imagine there are many other people on here who earn over 60k joint, and others who earn that or a lot more alone. (neverdespairgirl and her partner being one such couple who spring to mind).

We are self-employed, so it's a bit different - after chambers contributions, professional fees, etc, we are both earning about £45k pa.

pickledpink

Nearly all flats in London are leasehold (even Belgravia) so why the OP is becoming all stroppy about it does seem rather silly.

A freeholder is not a landlord - they just own the land the building sits on. There are occasionally some restrictions as to what you do to the exterior of the building (building garages etc) but generally the freeholder doesn't give a hoot about the place - they just want their ground rent. Full stop.

Some leaseholds can run for 999 years and the ground rent can be as low as £10 a year!! Once you have lived in the property for a certain amount of years (just a few years - not sure of the exact amount) by law the freeholder HAS to sell the freehold to you if you want to buy it. But if the leasehold runs for almost 1000 years and you only pay a ground rent of a few pounds a year it seems pretty pointless.

If leaseholding bothers you so much (and it doesn't bother the likes of Saatchi, for example) then get together with the other leaseholders and just buy the freehold. You'll then have a share of the freehold, which will mean paying a peppercorn rent of about 2 pennies a year and you'll feel better in the head.

You will still need permission to add things like dormer lofts/extensions/garages,conversions etc.....................and you'll need to apply to the local council for permission. That applies to both leaseholders and freeholders.

As for the actual property you're buying - what you do to the inside of it has nothing to do with the freeholder. You own the property - he owns the land.

By the way, the estate agent only need ask the seller who the freeholder is, so why you can't seem to find out seems very strange to me!

BTW, I would never live close to a fish shop - or a KFC/Kebab shop. Besides the smell of all that fishy fat bubbling away you could have hordes of people queuing up late at night - think of the noise!!!!