Uneneforceable & Voidable loans

angelwillow

Thanks for the help - have already sent for the SAR so will check it over when I get it.

in2deep_2

Please forgive my lack of brain cells but whats an SAR and is it something i should check.

angelwillow

It's a subject access request and is basically all the info that the company/bank hold about you - it should include all correspondance ie letters/paperwork,phone conversations etc.
You are entitled to it under the Data Protection Act and usually costs £10 to get.

Menucha

Hi
Does the following apply to us? "So what makes an agreement voidable? Normally it will be the payment of secret commissions and the fact that where something like PPI or GAP insurance has been taken out, upto certain dates, lenders did not disclose the financial arrangement that they had with the insurers and or the brokers"
Our Loan is with Natwest. It's a consolidation Loan of which the Loan repayment per month is 383.86 plus Insurance Loan repayment of £105.57.
There is nothing anywhere on the paperwork about any commissions paid by the bank to the PPI etc.
Also bearing in mind that we are currently claiming on PPI (you will see the problems we are having with this on my other thread today)

Thanks

Philippa

homer_j_3

There could be an issue potentially but its very close to the date where a lot of lenders decided to put the loan agreements in line with the law.

Now, as I understand it, Natwest have been disclosing commission in 2005 but it may have been a sentence in a booklet that accompanied the loan agreement or even in the agreement which states something along the lines of "a commission may paid". Now, if this is the case, the points I have written about here do not really apply but you may have something else that may help you.

Under the case law of wilson and another vs hurstanger ltd it was deemed that natwest had sufficiently covered themselves from committing an act of bribery on the basis that they had indicated a commission was to be paid and on this basis the judge could not make the loan voidable. However, as the lender had failed to be specific to the amount of commission, he felt there was a halfway house rule which ultimately ended up in the amount of commission being paid being returned to the borrower.

So, you would need to do a SAR - which is the process that allows you to obtain all the information that the natwest hold on you and ask them that you wish to know what commission was received for the sale of the PPI policy. When you get that back, you will then need to write a letter to recoup this commission as per the ruling of the case I referred to above.

A lot of people that are claiming PPI are not going for the commissions that have been paid out to the brokers for selling them which is can often be an entitlement. Anyway let me know how you get on.

adam060577

Hi, sorry but i am really confused. I took out a Mortgage with Northern Rock in March 2002. In may 03, jun 03, and june o4 i had secured loans of them. We were not asked to sign any thing for the loans, the money was realeased. These loans run side by side with our mortgage, at the same %.

In 2005 we remortgaged and fixed for 5 years. Does this sound like i need to investigate further?

Also in 1999 i took out a car loan, and in 2004, both were interest loaded at the beginning. Should i look at these as well?

I'm really sorry for being a tad thick, i have read and re-read to try and understand this, but i cant.

Thanks.

pamril1

Hi Homer j.
I had posted this on the reclaiming thread but after reading your thread am feeling that there may have been greater issues surrounding this car loan. Could you have a quick glance over and give me your opinion please.

"Back in 2003 my OH bought a car and the very pushy salesman told him he had to take out ppi. The finance itself was through black horse.
In 2004 my OH fell out of work and the ppi covered a few months payments 3 at most. Anyway unable to keep up payments and black horse not accepting lower payments he defaulted, the car (which was broke beyond repair just out of warranty so had not been used for ages!) was repossessed and there ensued much legal action and us deeper in debt after having to remortgage to cover everything.
Although we don't have the paperwork with the original cca etc I am thinking about requesting this and also a SAR to look into the possibility of reclaiming the ppi as I remember it was added as a lump sum at the beginning of the agreement. But as he had payments made for 3 months through the ppi where do we stand?"





Once I get the SAR I will obviously be in a better position to judge if this was infact unenforcable/voidable and If it was we will be seeking action after all that we went through. I just happened to look at your thread and decided to get your opinion. As I said in my other post this loan became the focus of legal action resulting in a charging order and a remortgage to cover all of the loan/interest/ppi/court costs and also much distress.

homer_j_3

Sorry for the delay in responding, I am normally a bit quicker than this but have been away from my computer this aft.

Your loan does sound like there will be issues just from the dates that you mention and the fact that lump sum PPI was included.

The first thing that I would say is that you have to separate my information from that on the main sticky surrounding claiming PPI back as the issues I talk about are wider reaching and as a result look to go further than just getting the PPI back.

Where a loan is voidable, which this sounds like it is, you would look to get the PPI back, the commission paid for the act of bibery and then the net debt being transformed into an interest free debt. Clearly you need help and this would be of benefit to you.

How much was the loan for and the PPI?

pamril1

Hi homer thanks for your reply.
Unfortuantely we no longer have the original paperwork for the loan until I can get my hands on the cca and SAR I can't give exact figures but it was roughly £4999 for the loan,£1500 ppi and although I know it was a high interest rate I could not say what as yet.
Since the remortgage I have had my concerns about the loan for many reasons. You see when we went to get the car it was originally meant to be joint, both myself and OH signed etc and we were excepted. We went away and the next day went to collect the car, the pushy salesman said he had changed it into my OH name only as he had adverse credit and there for if we went joint would effect my credit as we would then be financially linked (how considerate I thought then) of course this meant a higher APR with Black Horse than before and I honestly did not question why he did not put it solely through in my name as my credit was quite good at the time (we were very naive) Seeing this thread made me contemplate the salesmans motives and now question if he was in fact on commission for getting those with bad credit to sign up to the higher APR. As I said he also pushed for the ppi so he sounds like he was getting a kickback for something.
I'm sorry for whaffling on I'm just trying to get out all the information I remember in order to give a clearer picture.

adam060577

adam060577 wrote: »

Hi, sorry but i am really confused. I took out a Mortgage with Northern Rock in March 2002. In may 03, jun 03, and june o4 i had secured loans of them. We were not asked to sign any thing for the loans, the money was realeased. These loans run side by side with our mortgage, at the same %.

In 2005 we remortgaged and fixed for 5 years. Does this sound like i need to investigate further?

Also in 1999 i took out a car loan, and in 2004, both were interest loaded at the beginning. Should i look at these as well?

I'm really sorry for being a tad thick, i have read and re-read to try and understand this, but i cant.

Thanks.

Help please. Anyone? Homer