ING - repaying their mistake is crippling us

IvanOpinion

I think it highlights the golden rule ... don't touch money that is not yours. The OP KNEW this was a mistake but they still spent it .. a very silly thing to do. Did you not think that someday someone would notice the mistake? There is fault all round here including the OP and the Aunt - you say ING admit to making a mistake??? WHat exactly did they say in their letter? The paying in slip is probably the tell-tale (although it would seem very coincidental that they managed to make a mistake that put it into your account - are the surnames the same, the account numbers similar etc. ... you should always check on your accounts after a large transfer. The fact that CAB and a solicitor does not want to touch it speaks volumes.

Anyhows enough of a slap on the wrist that does not help. It looks like you must have a loan for about £5000-6000 what interest rate etc. are ING offering and over what term? I would agree with previous posters in trying to negotiate with ING for a longer period of time or adding the amount onto the mortgage (probably a much lesser interest rate). Alternatively look for a lower cost loan.

Ivan

IvanOpinion

eastchristina wrote:

I think we're just disorganised in our family - or perhaps it's just me! I've been known to make loans to people and COMPLETELY forget I've done it (not £10k, admittedly, but reasonable amounts of money). When people give the money back I look at them blankly for a while........I really do forget!

Can you loan me a couple of grand and I will pay you back sometime next year

Ivan

jobbingmusician

Yes, sure....if I don't forget to do it :):)

CazyDee

WOW!
To be honest I just came on here to vent a bit.

But... just to make it clear....

My auntie became significantly richer a few years ago when she inherited pots of cash - half a million I think - in property. Having sold that property she has put a lot of money in investments such as ING.

So... to her... lending me £10,000 wasn't a big deal.

We both have accounts with ING and shared the very rare surname IZOD

To save the bother of having to transfer from a current account, I wrote a cheque for £10,000 payable to her and posted this to ING.

I said I'd sent the cheque to her account and that was that.

A week later I went to ING online. and saw that £10,000 had appeared in my account

I called ING straight away asking if there'd been a mix-up and that I'd just paid a cheque for that very ammount to my relative. She assured me that there was no mistake and that the money was mine! I can remember the feeling - absolute amazement and gratitude. I was crying on the phone telling the ING lady that my auntie must have taken my repayment and transferred the money back to me - I honoured our agreement - didn't take advantage of her. I'd finally paid her back and she'd just given it right back to me.

I called her and said how grateful I was - how much it meant to me - £10,000 !!!
What a fab auntie.
Turns out - All the time I was thanking her, she thought I was thanking her for the loan. - "thanks for the £10 grand, that's ok, no really...it means so much, well that's fine I'm glad I could help.....etc"

Then, when the letter arrived asking for the money back, I got proof that it was their mistake.... they posted a photocopy of the cheque wrongly deposited into my account. It was CLEARLY her name and not mine. Clerical error.

OK - thinking back, I wish I'd been more clear with my auntie at the time but I was just so happy.

I'm not stupid to think that money just appears in bank accounts - that's why I called ING straight away.

I'm sure anyone would react the same in the same situation - where the'd been re-assured by both bank and rich relative that no mistake had been made.

I didn't go on a crazed spending spree - thinking I'd try and 'get away with it'

I left the money in the account untouched for 3 months before spending it.

And the worst thing is.... the solicitors said that if I'd bought a car for £10k with the money, and kept the receipt - I'd have had a strong case for actually keeping it!

But... the money's not mine and I'm paying it back. I don't want to take out a loan because the only debt I have is my mortgage. I've never had a credit card and I'm not prepared to get in debt because of their mistake.

flea72

you cant just send a cheque off with a name on it, you also have to quote the account number which you want that money to go into, so you must have put your own account number on the paying in slip

even if the bank had said that the cheque had been deposited in the right account (namely yours, because that must be the a/c number you gave), then yes the bank would be correct in saying that the money had been deposited into your account

my next port of call, would have been to ask my relative, if they had received the money, as it appears to have turned up back in my account. - they would then have checked and seen they hadnt got the money, or have said no, ive given you it back

to assume your relative had given you back the money, without even questioning it? my first reaction, would have been to ask my relative, if they were sure i could have it, and then keep asking again and again.

really this is of your own doing, but as an aside, you should be able to get a better interest rate than 8%, and over more years, to bring the repayments down

Trow

Well I think people are being a bit harsh on the op - after all the aunt does appear to have received the money (as in thanks for repaying it) in the opening post, it is ING that are out of pocket and that she is having to repay after their mistake in crediting BOTH accounts and then telling her that the money was hers.

She thanked the aunt for the money, which the aunt concurred with when she said it was no problem - op wasn't to know that the wires were crossed.

Good luck to you CazyDee, it must be tough going, I would not be able to afford loan repayments of £200 on top of living expenses etc.

CazyDee

Thanks for your support Trow.

I did write my aunties account number on the back of her cheque.
ING wrote to me saying that they had made a mistake.
They posted a copy of the cheque to me - with her details clearly written on it.

The monthly repayments are interest free.
It took lots of calls and me saying to their Customer Service Manager that he should take me to court if he wanted me to pay extra for their mistake.

Thankfully they didn't take me up on that offer!

Wig

ahhhh,

So you have it interest free, well that's not so bad then. You have had use of their money interest free to buy yourselves stuff for your house. How much? you suggest it's about 5 - 6,000 so you're looking at 2 1/2 years @ 200 pounds a month interest free.

I don't know what the solicitors were telling you but if you were looking to keep the money...no way jose! If you were looking for a reasonable payback scheme (interest free) then this was entirely do-able under our laws, you had been put in a position of unexpected loss which was 70% - 80% the fault of ING, some fault has to lie with you and your Aunt not clarifying the situation more clearly, although, from what you have said it all sounds very plausible if only a little unfortunate..... Anyway as I was saying, you had an unexpected loss not of your doing - the fault created by ING you are not entitled to keep the money (dunno where he got that car story from - I'll have to look into that -) but you are entitled to repay the money at an amount according to your means and interest free. It seems you got half of what you were entitled to namely "interest free", the amount is maybe a little high, but if it went to court maybe they would look at what a typical loan repayment would be on a 6000 pound loan and use that as an acceptable figure for repayment. So you haven't done too badly.

As an aside the bank person could not really have known it was not a mistake without having the cheque infront of her, and as we know that was not the case you shouldn't have accepted her advice that this was a kosher transaction - how the hell does she know? So the next step in the confirmation routine would be to say to your aunt,
"I just got off the phone with ING and they tell me you have recieved the 10,000 and paid it straight back into my account, is that correct"...

But we all know you got your wires crossed and it didn't turn out that way, so this is a series of unfortunate events, which you are coming through slightly scathed, but not overly so.

btw, it's still not too late to get a solicitor or citizens advice solicitor to look into this and try to get a smaller monthly amount agreed.

cheers

Wig

IvanOpinion

Wig wrote:

As an aside the bank person could not really have known it was not a mistake without having the cheque infront of her, and as we know that was not the case you shouldn't have accepted her advice that this was a kosher transaction - how the hell does she know? So the next step in the confirmation routine would be to say to your aunt,
"I just got off the phone with ING and they tell me you have recieved the 10,000 and paid it straight back into my account, is that correct"...

That is actualy a damned good point ... the operator would only know what was on their screen and they will generally accept that it is correct - all they will see is a cheque comnig out and another one going in a few days later.

Ivan

Wig

Also odd the the aunt didn't query it for over 3 months. But maybe she was on quarterly statements, and with all that loot, foolishly didn't check that 10,000 had recently been paid in. I wonnder if they are paying the aunty interest for the missing 3 -4 months?

And odd that once the Aunt realised the money was missing she didn't phone the niece to say the money was not in her account.