Unsigned credit agreement

bokkie7975

Hi , hoping for some advice and info regarding where we stand;

we pay the car insurance monthly via direct debit, the date has been changed, despite the broker being asked to verify the dates would remain unchanged, so there wasn't enough in the account to cover the payment.
We have been charged by the bank- £39 and also by the credit company- £20.

But , here's the question -
I just found the credit agreement in the drawer = unsigned.

Can the credit company just take payments without this agreement being signed and can the bank just pay out without this document?

Any advice will be grately appreciated.
thanks in advance.
L

gizmoleeds

I would assume not, but it may be a tricky legal area - you say this is car insurance. Unless you can show you have held insurance with another company aswell then you can't argue that they were taking money without your permission, they were simply taking it without your written permission

greenwich

If I understand you correctly, you have an annual insurance policy but are paying the premiums monthly and paying interest. If so then the credit agreement is presumably covered by the Consumer Credit Act 1974. You have an unsigned copy but are you sure that at some point in the past you didn't sign a credit agreement of which you never got a copy?

I only ask because if it's true that you never signed the credit agreement then it is unenforceable against you. This means that you could refuse to pay the monthly instalments (not just the interest but the premiums as well) and you could not be sued by the finance company. The Consumer Credit Act 1974 is very tough on lenders. Even the slightest error means that the consumer is not bound by the agreement, even though the finance company remains fully liable to honour its side of the deal!

There was an amazing case that went to the law lords a couple of years ago. A Mrs. Wilson borrowed £5,000 from a pawnbroker and gave her BMW as security. The pawnbrokers made a mistake in filling in the form. She spotted the error, refused to pay the loan back, and sued them to get her car back. The law lords ruled that because of the mistake Mrs. Wilson was not bound by the finance agreement. So she got to keep the £5,000, not pay it back, and got her car back too. Hard luck on the pawnbrokers. You can read it all here: http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/ld200203/ldjudgmt/jd030710/will-1.htm

I am not suggesting you should necessarily go down this road. If you do, you'll have to fight the finance company, though if the facts are as they appear to be you should win.

fabienne_2

start by asking to wave the fee of late payment by phone, asking VERY NICELY, beg, cry, ask to talk to their manager, say please, please and please again.... ("it is my budget for Nappies" works well) do the same thing for the bank. If they both work, good, you are £52 less poorer!
if not:
Ask then in writing a copy of the signed aggreement they should have. you could try first to say that you don't remember signing it, they will be to happy to try to prove you wrong. get the history of payment and their average date out of your account, if the new date is really far away, ask them IN WRITING to produce the documents stating the warning for the change of debt as the action does not comply with the direct debit garantee (sorry i am rubbish at spelling).
Check that you do not have a printed list of DD date (paymant shedule?) that would have told you when the money was oout. (water company send those fro exemple, or studient loan -i think)
ring a week after to ask if they found a signed credit aggrement, as you are not aware to have given permition for the change of date and it did cost you money (don't forget to say thank you for waving the late fee if you manager this one). DO NOT DISCUSS ANYTHING ELSE. confirm phone conversation in writing.
1) they have a sign aggreement, but the date is well off the usual dates, you can still call on the direct debit garantee, letter in the style of " here is list of dates, here is date that caused problem, see the difference. if you do not consider it to be covered by dd garantee, please confirm in writting with justificating documents of change of date. i am only asking you to wave the fee,
same letter to your bank showing dates differences and asking to make DD garantee apply on it.
2) they don't have an aggreement, they should have sent you a letter saying "oups, here is your money". (ask for a discount on next year insurance, you never know..)
send a letter to your bank, asking them why they authorised the payment of your account, with copy of the letter from insurance, say you would like those £32 back thank you.
good luck, it worked for me.
fabienne

bingo_bango

The first thing you should do is to contact your local TRADING STANDARDS. They can give you the support needed to argue an unenforcable credit agreement as specified by the CCA '74. The finance company may try to bluff you, but they can't bluff Trading Standards. Start by writing to the finance company and asking for a copy of the signed agreement. You'll need to know if they have a copy with YOUR signature before you can fight this.
As well as this, ask your bank to take back the DD. They are obliged to do this until an investigation has been carried out into why the payment was taken against your wishes. I realise that you probably made a verbal agreement with the creditor about the date of the debit, but that does not mean the bank won't believe you that the conversation took place.

impy78

This would really depend on whether the insurance is based on a written contract, or on a verbal contract.

If at any point you have signed a proposal form (which not all companies use), then you may have needed to have signed the mandate.

HOWEVER, if you did not sign and return a proposal form and you have entered into a verbal contract, and you would not have needed to have signed a mandate. However, in this instance the insurer would have to advise you that the direct debit would be set up automatically, and the initial call would need to have been taped. In which case you need to get the insurer to pull the tape.

bokkie7975

Just as well we didn't rock the boat about this - some little F%^*$%£ wrote the car off while trying to steal it. :mad: