What are the chances?

X-man

I’ve just noticed the following anomaly on a loan agreement signed by my mother and late father.

The signature box at the bottom has three lines as follows;

Signature(s)_______________________

Customer(s)_______________________

Date_____________________________

The ‘Signature’ has been signed by my late father

The ‘Customer’ has been signed by my mother

The ‘Date’ has been completed correctly


After my father passed away, the DCA’s are chasing my mother for repayment of the joint loan but technically, she has only signed as the ‘Customer’.

Therefore could I argue that technically, the loan isn’t a joint loan and therefore mum is not liable for any repayments?

stapeley

I doubt it, your mothers signature appears on the agreement be it below your fathers, it is within the prescribed area for signatures. Was no insurance taken out ?

X-man

No insurance cover unfortunately.

My mothers name only appears on the agreement as the 'Customer' and it could be argued that it doesn't constitute a signature, in which case, she has no liability for repayment of the loan?

Am I plucking at straws or is this worth looking into........

sparky0107

X-man wrote: »

No insurance cover unfortunately.

My mothers name only appears on the agreement as the 'Customer' and it could be argued that it doesn't constitute a signature, in which case, she has no liability for repayment of the loan?

Am I plucking at straws or is this worth looking into........

Hi X-man,
Try posting your original post on the loans board, link below:-

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.html?f=12

Also try to PM m.colak, who is a regular poster on the PPI reclaim discussion board. HTH

HHH_2

I think actually he was just asking a question to try to help his mother who has some financial problems and has been widowed. kindness costs nothing you know!

rog2

HHH wrote: »

I think actually he was just asking a question to try to help his mother who has some financial problems and has been widowed. kindness costs nothing you know!

Well said, tripleH. :T :T

Incisor would be well advised to read Martin Lewis's anouncement http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/announcement.html?f=76 before making any further 'cutting' comments.

rog2

X-man wrote: »

Due to the circumstances in which this loan was given, if I can get out of paying it based on a technicality, then I will.

May I ask, X-man, were the 'circumstances' in any way 'dubious'?

have you spoken with any of the Debt Counselling Charities, such as CCCS www.cccs.co.uk - tel 0800 138 1111 or National Debtline www.nationaldebtline.co.uk - tel 0808 808 4000.

They would, certainly, be able to tell you if the 'agreement' constitutes a true consumer credit agreement and if it is, indeed, enforceable.

Good Luck.

rog2

Incisor wrote: »

but do think carefully about your phrasing

I'm glad you quoted Martin, and that your quote included what is, in my opinion, the most important advice, ie 'thinking about your phrasing'. It is most unfortunate that your first post appears to have been written before you read Martin's announcement.

There are so many instances of creditors and debt collection agencies preying on debtors' assumed ignorance of the very laws that are designed to protect them, especially at times when they are going to be at their most vulnerable, that the OP is quite right in questioning the legality of such a 'debt'.
It may well be an enforceable agreement, in which case the OP will be able to seek advice on how best to deal with it.
It may, also, be that the OP's mother is, indeed, an unwitting victim of a predatory dca, whose only interest is to make money out of the unfortunate circumstances in which she now finds herself. If this is the case then the OP will, equally, recieve good advice, from the majority of the members of this forum, on how best to deal with the dca.
Clutching at straws - yes, and the OP has admitted that he would be happy if the agreement could be ruled invalid, due to a 'technicality'.
I see nothing wrong with that - after all, how many so-called 'debts' are enforced because of 'technicalities'?

kizzykizzywizzy

I have a similar problem that my Father was widowed just over a year ago, obviously when something like that happens, circumstances change & I'm sure the OP's parents fully intended to pay the loan when they took it out, but the Ops Mum can no longer afford it. The same as my Father, who took a loan out with my Mother not expecting her to die!
The thing with my Parents loan is that they DID ask for insurance, but were told they were to old, I'm sorry, but in my mind the bank took the risk & he shouldn't be paying, but he's old school & will pay probably until he dies too.
I'm really upset with Incisor's comments, judging how upset a person in by the fact that the HAVE to sort out the finances & he is trying to help his surviving parent have some quality of life after the death of their partner.
Have a heart
X-Man I'm really sorry for your loss & hope you can sort this out some how - take care :A

X-man

OK. My father took the loan out precisely one month before he died. He had been diagnosed with terminal stomach cancer in 2006. He had lost his hair, his skin was ashen and he was about 7 stone. It was clear he was severely ill. My mother never really got involved in the finances and my father took the loan out in, what I can only assume, was a desperate attempt to leave my mother with a few quid and pay off his credit card debts (which he did, even though the cards were covered by insurance in the event of his death).

My mum was at one of lifes low points when she signed for the loan. She didn't understand exactly what she was signing for, but even if she had, she would still have signed it. My father realised that the original loan wasn't covered by payment protection and tried to sign another agreement to cover the repayments in the event of his death. Fortunately/unfortunately, this agreement never came to fruition because it was incorrectly signed. My father left no estate when he died, therefore there is no money to pay off the loan.

I have negotiated a settlement figure with the DCA but after looking closely at the paperwork, spotted this anomaly with regard to the signatures and wondered if it was possible to refute on a technicality.

kizzykizzywizzy

X-man it's quite unbelievable that they would give a loan to someone with a terminal illness, when I say they wouldn't give my Parents insurance, I'm not sure how old my Mum was when the loan was taken, but she was only 66 when she died a year ago & my dad is now 71, so perhaps it was because he was over 70?
My Sister contacted CCCS & sent letters to my parents credit card companies with token payments of £1, changed his bank account direct debits etc, but he was having none of it & now lives on a pittance trying to pay all these things off & cope with my Mum's death, as he feels he should pay it, although I doubt they'll ever get it all back as they have "kindly" reduced the loan payments & spread it over a longer period!! I bet they couldn't believe their luck when he started paying again.
If someone thinks this is a better idea, to struggle for what's left of your life with debt, rather than plucking at straws, well I don't agree.
Good for you X-man for helping your Mum, I wish my dad wasn't so stubborn!