Land Registry Advice Please

Doozergirl

The plan doesn't show anything as being shared. That's just showing what is yours. The problem with the plan is that it doesn't correctly define boundaries - a legal boundary has no width at all. If you blew that map up to scale you'd find you had boundary lines a metre wide!

I'm not sure whether it's universal but on the house we've just bought we have red for what is ours, blue for the shared part of the drive and green where we have right of way over someone else's land.

Have you downloaded the title register as well as the plan? The register should list any covenants or rights of way. With other properties where neighbours have had rights of way, it has always been clearly on the plan.

Doozergirl

What the positions of things are may not make a lot of difference to the legals but I've honestly tried to work it all your directions and explanations out and because I can't see the gates in question or where your front doors are, I haven't got a clue!

bigheadxx

If you are a tenant then the boundary dispute is really between your landlord and the neighbour. You would almost certainly need your landlords permission to erect a fence. Have you asked your LL what the protocol was when he occupied the property? Also is your neighbour a tenant or owner occupier because it is the property owner that you would need to undertake any negotiations with. You can also obtain the deeds for the property next door which may detail any rights of way or covenants but such rights of way can be built up over time by encroachment ie the neighbour trespassing on the land and that trespass not being disputed.

janegresty

Yes I have downloaded the other part also and cannot find anything about anything shared, just the bit in red it says about. I am struggling too! But surely if it was a shared path they would not have a path and gate of their own? The LL does not want to upset the neighbours and neither do we... but we have only lived there a few days and already I am getting deeply frustrated with the kids leaving things all up the pathway, staring into the house and playing ball outside my front door. I'm worrying as too how I will manage with a newborn with all this noise going on right outside my front door. And the dogs bark like mad thinking someone is on their territory, which makes the kids wind them up even more

janegresty

bighead our LL works miles away. So even though she has lived in the house she has hardly ever been there. Which means next door have been able to do as they please without upsetting anyone. Also when the LL lived here the gate and driveway gates were left open 24/7... whereas now we are here we have started to close the gates so that the car is secure.
The LL says that the ideal thing to do would be to allow them to share the pathway and instead put a fence up around the driveway with a gate to our pathway. But she hasnt offered to pay for the fence which I am doubting she will as she is not bothered about them sharing the path.
But we really do want the privacy! Any suggestions?

Doozergirl

If you are desperate to mark off the boundaries then you could show them copies of the title plans and registers for both properties and show that nothing is 'shared' according to those and there is a definate boundary, (albeit one that you can't establish the exact location of) and ask them if they have documentation (original deeds perhaps) to show that it is legally shared and not simply an informal agreement. If they can, then you back down, otherwise explain in the nicest terms that the planned fence is to keep the dogs in and not them out, iyswim.

I'd just tread slowly through and back down if it gets to the point that it might involve solicitors. It isn't your fight to fight.

Is there a fence between you and the neighbours land but an open area near the front doors which they walk across onto your (assumed by the presence of a fence) land (path)? And you just want to block that bit, hence that being cheaper than a whole new fence around the drive?

janegresty

Yes Dozergirl. We did actually ask them the day we moved in about putting up a gate there. There response was "yes no problem, aslong as we can still use the shared pathway". So I am tempted to put the gate up... so they have access to the pathway... but let the dogs have full run. Then hopefully instead if having the dogs jumping up at them... they will just use their own pathway? I know it sounds mean. but on the other hand I am worried the kids will be in and out and the dogs will end up out on the road running for the hills because the kids have let them out of the garden or left the gate open!

Doozergirl

I was wondering about that. Perhaps you could just put it there and let the dogs do their toilet by the gate :rotfl:

It does sound very odd however that there is something which could be considered as a boundary marker in the form of the fence which they need to cross. Common sense would tell me that if they were allowed across, it would be in the forom of a Right of Way rather than something that is shared. I can't think of any land I've 'shared' that has had any kind of boundary markers.

Even if they have right of way, you can put a gate there. It's your land. They just need access to it.

ZCC72

The Property Register (Official Copy of Register Entries) will detail any shared access - it is also usually shown on the plan, but hatched in a different colour. However, as you are a tenant, the issue is that of your landlords - you may well find that your tenancy agreement states that you must notify your landlord of any issues - therefore, let them know, and let them bear the costs. Under the terms of your AST (if you have one) you will most likely be entitled to "quiet enjoyment" and that will apply to neighbours that are trespassing....
I hope this assists.

(please note that, whilst I hope the info is useful, it does not constitute legal advice - I only have a responsibility to fee paying clients).

ZCC72

The Property Register (Official Copy of Register Entries) will detail any shared access - it is also usually shown on the plan, but hatched in a different colour. If no shared access is mentioned in the Property Register, or maintenance contributions towards shared access, then it is most likely the case that your gate and path is for your house, and the neighbours gate and path is for their house.

However, as you are a tenant, the issue is that of your landlords - you may well find that your tenancy agreement states that you must notify your landlord of any issues - therefore, let them know, and let them bear any costs. Under the terms of your AST (if you have one) you will most likely be entitled to "quiet enjoyment" and that will apply to neighbours that are trespassing....

I hope this assists.

(please note that, whilst I hope the info is useful, it does not constitute legal advice - I only have a responsibility to fee paying clients).