Debt advice regarding iva's/bankruptcy

fermi

Hi Robflh

I can answer some of those (to the best of my knowledge anyway ).

Robflh wrote: »

Do not default on the mortgage or any loans secured against the house. This would allow them to start proceeding against you and never ever just give the keys back.

If with professional advice you decide on BR (EDIT-->) and don't want to keep the house then this is often very much the best thing to do.:rolleyes:

Robflh wrote: »

Does the IVA cover just the unsecured debts or unsecured and secured debts or does it cover all debts.

Unsecured debts only.

Robflh wrote: »

If you filed for bankruptcy and the OR did not sell the house, you need to find out what happens to the mortgage and the debts secured against it.

As discussed, any shortfall goes into the bankruptcy. What the OR or mortgage company do with it isn't your problem any more.

Robflh wrote: »

You can afford to pay the mortgage but not all the other debts, most of which are not even yours.

Could be wrong, but it sounds as if most of the debts are joint. In which case there is a Joint & Several Liability regarding them.

Robflh wrote: »

You seem to have already given up. I know you are finding it difficult to cope with all this but you need to hang in there until you have all the information and then when you have all the information you can make an informed decision.

Excuse me for saying this Toon_Dave, but it doesn't seem as if you have given up. Advice from this site can be very helpful, but you are doing the correct thing which is seeking professional and independent advice. I'm sure that will be the deciding factor here, rather than "giving up".

Toon_Dave

Hi Robflh,

Thanks for the post, i think the iva only works on unsecured debts and not the mortgage and secured loans, which are upto date - although i pay more per month for the loan for previous arrears and court fees so that may be subject to the IVA.

with regards to BR and paying for the mortgage and loans secured on it, that is still allowed as long as the payments are not considered excessive. and also they cant make you sell (apparently) if there is little or no equity left in the property - the main sticking point which i will find out and confirm is that the hosue and secured loan are joint so i am only responisble for the half share (i think!!)

i know it sounds like im resigning my fact to losing the house. to be honest im just not sure i want to live alone where i am as its a distance from my friends and family so may feel happier in myself if moved nearer to home...i have been ill in hospital recently too so think having loved ones near by may be better for my health long term.

i am certainly going to wait until i have all the information to hand and have exhausted all options such as iva etc. i am speaking to the IP tm and CCCS too so should have a better understanding of exactly what will and wont happen for me after then.

i will update tm afternoon or night if im any clearer.

Cheers for the advice.

Dave.

fermi

Toon_Dave wrote: »

the main sticking point which i will find out and confirm is that the hosue and secured loan are joint so i am only responisble for the half share (i think!!)

As far as I know they fall under Joint & Several Liability which means that either person can be chased and is liable for the full amount.

But get that confirmed for the debts you have.

If you have taken out a credit agreement, such as a loan or bank account in joint names (with another person) then you are both liable for the full amount of any debt. NB. Credit cards are not taken in joint names, if you have two cards, then only one cardholder is considered the account holder. They will be responsible for full repayment for the debt, regardless of which card was used.

This means that if you have a joint loan with a spouse or partner and one of you fails to repay the debt (this often happens following divorce or separation) then the lender could still ask you for payment of the full amount (not just half).

The lender cannot recover the money twice but can pursue both of you, or just one of you, for all amounts still outstanding until they have obtained full payment.

Joint and several liability can also apply to rent arrears on joint tenancies, arrears on joint mortgages, Council Tax payments and water charges on properties that have been jointly occupied.

Toon_Dave

hi and thanks fermi for the not giving up line, i appreciate that. i am trying to get as much advice and assistance so i know what all my potential options are.

You are correct in the assumoption that most of outstanding debt is joint nameley the mortgage and secured loan (82,000) in total, which is all charged on the property. If it means that me EX has to admit responsibility and has to go bankrupt too then all the better as at present she has gotten away with most of it and i think she felt that when she left and said she would sign the house to me she thought that was the end of that.

But as you said we are both joint and severally liable for what happens as we both signed the aggreements.

Thanks once again and i will update this tm after speaking to cccs and the IP recommended from the CAB, who i must say have been great with the free help so far to me.

Dave.

Robflh

Hi fermi

Thank you for the extra info. As I said before, I am not sure what servicing the debt means. I am guessing that it means making payments but again I am not sure if that means normal payments or reduced payments (like a DMP has).

Again, I am assuming that the mortgage and any loans secured against the house would have to be serviced and not just the mortgage.

The mortgage and one loan are joint debts and the rest are credit cards (unsecured debts). One of the credit cards has a CCJ. As far as I know, the loan that has recently come to light is not a joint loan nor is it secured against the house but northern rock has got a charging order against the property. That is as good as a secured loan and it might prevent the transfer of the other half of the house to him.

If the Northern Rock loan is in her name only and she can still and does transfer the house to him, that loan will have nothing to do with him. If they sell the house right now, again that debt would have nothing to do with him. There would be no equity left in the house but the two joint debts will have been killed.

That would just leave the unsecured debts (£16,400), which an IVA could reduce. I say could because without the mortgage and the secured loan to pay for Dave would have a surplus of over £1,000 a month minus accommodation costs. With or without an IVA Dave would be debt free in five years or even less and he would not have to file for bankruptcy.

Selling the house and then filing for Bankruptcy would kill all Dave's debts, although he may have to make payments for a few years. However, being declared a bankrupt has its drawbacks. You only have to look at the Bankruptcy & Living With It forum to find out why. Therefore, I would sell the house and then go for an IVA.

Hi Toon_Dave

Filing for bankruptcy just to get her back would not be as good as it sounds. It is only the joint debt creditors that would go after her and their debts would be covered by selling the house.

The sale of the house would not cover the northern rock loan and they would then go after her but that will happen whether you sell the house or the OR sells it.

Toon_Dave

hi rob,

the newer loan from northern rock which i am hoping is going to be non secured although awaiting confirmation was taken out in my name only as my Ex was declined due to her medical state at the time - diabetes and depression so was taken out in my name only (DAMN!). so total unsecured is approx £51,000 including ccj, cc's and new loan.

The getting my own back option would just make me feel better but as you say would do nothing to help with the debts as the joint stuff would be cleared just by equity in the house.

i will update tm....oops i mean today now seeing as its after 12 now.

Thanks Rob

Dave.

fermi

Robflh wrote: »

Thank you for the extra info. As I said before, I am not sure what servicing the debt means.

Making monthly payments to the satisfaction of the creditor.

Robflh wrote: »

Again, I am assuming that the mortgage and any loans secured against the house would have to be serviced and not just the mortgage.

Yes.

Robflh wrote: »

However, being declared a bankrupt has its drawbacks. You only have to look at the Bankruptcy & Living With It forum to find out why.

Really? I better go have a look.:rolleyes:

Toon_Dave

Can you re-list all of the debts/liabilities stating whether they are joint and secured or not. There seems to be much confusion.

EDIT: Tomorrow. It's late!

Toon_Dave

[Toon_Dave

Can you re-list all of the debts/liabilities stating whether they are joint and secured or not. There seems to be much confusion.[/quote]

hi fermi, Here is my SOA for you.

Monthly salary - £1500

monthly outgoings - priority

Mortgage - £460 Balance £61,000 - JOINT
Secured loan - £535 Balance £21,000 - JOINT
council tax - £73 Balance £728
water - £31 Balance £217
Electric - £80 Pre-payment key
Service charge £50
telephone - £11
tv license - £14 Balance £140
life insurance -£10
food - £100
CCJ - C/C £85 Balance £3,400.

Total - £1449.00

Available to creditors - £51


Monthly outgoings - non-priority debts

goldfish C/C £13pm Balance £6,100
Lloyds TSB c/c £66pm Balance £2,800 - did not accept smaller amount pm
Sky C/C £10pm Balance £3,800
HFC Bank S/C £20pm Balance £240
HFC Bank £10pm Balance £60
Northern Rock £0pm Balance £ 35,000.

Per month - £119 - current commitments without paying northern rock loan.

Total non-priority debts - £ 48,000.

Total Debt as of march 2008 - £134,485.

i hope this stops any confusion - only joint debts are the mortgage and secured loan. everything else is my name - although i wasnt responsible for running up all the amounts owing.

Dave.

fermi

That's better.

With all the back and forth and some incorrect assumptions, it was getting a little hard to keep track.

Toon_Dave

true...well im off to bed now...got alot of phoning to do tm so guess need plenty of sleep if i can before i get on the blower.

night Fermi.

Dave.:dance: