Tortured for PIN

mymatebob

James wrote: »

First and foremost my deepest sympathy goes out to the relatives and friends of Georgina Edmonds.

This very sad story appeared in the Telegraph - Pensioner Murdered For Her PIN.

Which brings me back to a question I aksed sometime ago. Is it safer to PIN than sign?

yes it is - as backed up by all the figures thus far.

Next

PBA

James wrote: »

I honestly believe that it would be an awful lot safer for lots of people to revert to Chip & Signature Cards.

Given that the story you linked to is clearly an amateur job (no professional fraudster is going to murder someone, which he'd get life for, to nick a couple hundred quid), do you really think the lady would still be alive if she had a chip & sig card? If she said she didn't have a PIN they just wouldn't have believed her and carried on the "torture", thinking she was lying to them. Would she still be alive if she'd handed over the PIN straight away, then called the bank as soon as the intruders were gone to cancel the card? Can't say, but she certainly wasn't killed by chip & PIN.

ShelfStacker_3

James wrote: »

I'm sorry you feel this way about this illustration.

Never mind that you're using scaremongering tactics. "You could be murdered for your PIN so don't use chip and PIN" is scaremongering horsesh*t no matter what you say.

James

mymatebob wrote: »

yes it is - as backed up by all the figures thus far.

Next

Card fraud losses up by 25%: increase is driven by £90.5 million rise in fraud abroad as more UK card details stolen for use in countries yet to upgrade to chip and PIN

Source APACS - click here.

Crooks aren't cloning UK cards and using them in shops overseas. They're using the cloned cards (any old card with a magstrip) stealing PINs and hitting ATMs.

When they do nick valid cards & PINs and use them anywhere, in an ever increasing number of cases, victims are being held liable.

natweststaffmember

I think James wanted to make one point but chose the wrong story. James, I know you from another forum, which i do not visit these days, and I think the main point of your campaign as some call it, is that CHIP and PIN can be safer. Furthermore, a lot of retailers are ignorant to CHIP and SIGNATURE which is admirable of you. James you are right with regards to clonded cards and overseas transactions, but the figures do not include the amount of money that is actually debited from customers accounts as many banks spot an overseas ATM withdrawal and limit the card's use until confirming it. A look at this forum and other bank forums will show the posts on "My bank has stopped my card overseas and left me stranded". The advice we(NatWest) have given is to take currency abroad and use the card in an emergency.
You missed CARD NOT PRESENT which would not be picked up by signature cards.

lic

The safest way for the banks to protect customers cards is for them to put a lithograph of the card holder on the back. National and Provincial b/s were doing this 20+ years ago. This would only protect the customer from theft of the card/cloning for physical use. It would not prevent internet/atm theft etc.
In Eourope I beleive you have to show photographic i d when tendering a card, not that I am attempting to champion HMG's id cards.