house bounary - fence splits gardens where it meets house in wrong place

JohnHamer1977

OK a long one...

Where the fence (that splits our back gardens) meets the house it's way too far over onto my own side.
The end of the garden it's fine but it then comes diagonally in my way until it meets the house where it should just be straight and meet and divide the houses in the middle.

It's so obvious it's stupid, I could understand a disagreement at in the garden but where it meets the house it's just obvious it should be in the same place as the dividing walls between our houses.
I have a conservatory and even though it is well inside my bouderies I can not get down the side.

The fence is damaged and bent and needs replacing.
I think it's my fence to take down as it's on my side and the nice side is facing next door.
I am paying for a whole new fence, the right size posts and panels all to be fitted.
I want to put it back in the right place ONLY at the house end so it will put the fence back exactly (or even slightly on my side) splitting the houses.
Here are some pics to try and show you what I mean, hard to see on a photo so have put a little diagram in:



Green line shows where it should be and even that is still more on my side.



This is just a pic from further back, still hard to see though.


Just to add to the above...

As you can see in the 1st photo, if you look down in a stright line out of the back bedroom window you look into next doors garden - that's obviously not right. My house would have to be built ion there land for that to be right.
Also, that window is suppose to be a fire escape window, if you put ladders down you would get off them in next doors garden!!!

Next door have said the fence is OK to be moved but they insist it's only 4 inches!!! The fence actually needs moving over about 2 foot or a bit less to make sure it still stays inside my boudary.
As said above now I have added this extra info, would like to know what the general thoughts you guys have here would be?
Where do you think I stand?

ukjoel

We had exactly the same problem. In fact ours was funnier as we had patio doors and part of the doors opened into next doors garden.

We were lucky in that next door was still owned by the council so we went straight to them. They got a guy out who looked at it and agreed that it was out and was due to the council putting up a fence a few years back and working around a couple of hedges instead of cutting them down. End result fence was 3 foot the wrong way.

We sent them a letter asking if they wished to correct the problem - fence was there responsibility or they could pay us rent of £2000 a year for the square footage we were losing. They came round the next week and moved it.

If the house is council it will be easier for you to move fence. Ignore tennants and go straight to council.

If not wait for a windy night and pull the fence nearest the house down.
Borrow a dog from a friend and have it go to the toilet all over their garden.
When they insist you replace fence - put it up in right place.

If you disagree on place mark lines where u think boundary is and get a surveyor to decided. The who who is furthest from his line pays his bill.

Its hard to see from the pics where it should be - I would COUNT bricks although looking at the pic the drainpipe seems fairly centre. It also looks like they put fence on your side of pipe but its leaning which accounts for about a foot of give.

Had another look - second pic is better - Follow line of tiles down to bricks and straight down. Your right. Fence should be their side of pipe.

First do they own house.
If not who does?
If they do own it have the discussion you have had with them. It sounds like they admit it needs moving but dont want it moved too much. Hence count BRICKS. That way worst case is your half a brick in disagreement or a couple of inches.
Measure both gardens and be straight with them.
If they are pratts then wait till they go on holiday or are out for the day and replace it and put it where you think it should be- take pics and document and if they take it down -call police - criminal damage. Small claims court ending with a charge on the house as they own it and you know where they live.

Not nice but I know where you are coming from. Ob the positive it took 2 years but our neighbours are talking to us, but they get well shifty if they see me with a tape measure in the garden.

Just cos your right doesnt mean other people see it that way I am afraid.
But often thats cos they are idiots

ukjoel

Ooh one other thought - We had one of those arial plane pics that we bought at the door for a fiver and it clearly showed the fence was wrong.
When we spoke to another neighbour she pulled out a pic taken ten years earlier which a hedge in the correct place.
Apparently its a common problem in council houses as people dont always care about a foot here or a foot there if they are renting but when they own every inch is contested like its got gold buried underneath.

[Deleted User]

That happened to us, my next door neighbour claimed that he had lost a few inches of garden because the fence posts were not in a straight line. The good neighbours that we are, we let him move it a few inches so it is now straight and right in the middle. It made sense anyway, if I were in his shoes I would have done the same. Hopefully your neighbours will see sense, like we did.

olibrofiz

Just a thought, it looks like if you do move the fence it'll result in the down pipe being in your garden? I know such things are possibly classed as 'shared' responsiblity, but my mum's had problems with her neighbours in that their guttering gets blocked, they shove the blockage towards the pipe, it blocks the pipe, and they insist she's responsible for it cos it's on her side of the fence. Beware

LittleTinker

You need to find out what it says on your deeds because it really doesnt matter what you think it should be like if the deeds say something else.

Debt_Free_Chick

In many cases, it's impossible to tell where the physical boundary is - you can't transpose a line on a map to a line on the ground as there are no reference points.

In this case, however, it looks as though the fence has simply been placed one side of the downpipe. If the downpipe is shared, then it would be reasonable to assume that the boundary is down the middle of the pipe. You then have two problems - placing the fence exactly in line with the pipe; not possible and it would block access to the drain. Or, placing the fence on one side of the pipe - resulting in either you or your neighbour losing a bit of land.

It looks like the downpipe has been replaced or moved at some point Is the downpipe your neighbour's? It appears that it is (it seems like your bathroom & downpipe is on the left of your house, looking at the photo. Look carefully to the right of the green line .... do I see a mark where that downpipe used to be? Was it originally on a line where the outlet from the bathroom sink is?

It looks to me as if the downpipe is your neighbour's and should be over to the right, which would mean the fence would be placed in line with the boundary.

Some very careful negotiations needed here, I think.

Debt_Free_Chick

Further thought .... wonder if next door moved the downpipe to accommodate their conservatory?

And then the fence was added later

JohnHamer1977

Thanks for the replys.

Next door came round again, better attitude this time.
I dangled a plumb line out of the back bedroom window and lined the string up with where the fence is to take photos... basically it was like the pic in the 1st post with the red line.

They must have seen this and re-considered there 4 inches.
It helped make it even mor obvious as it was more than 4" from the string to the edge of the upstairs window sill.

We have agree'd to move the fence to the grid that the drain pipe goes into.
This is still 2 bricks worth more on my side (going off the middle of the party wall) but it's a comprmise I am OK with and saves any legal probs and further falling out.

I think it's a reasonable result... what do you giuys think?

[Deleted User]

That is great that you came to a compromise.

Poppycat

Judging by that picture I wonder if it was moved there when fence was built due to the drainpipe however not in your favour. I agree it does looks like its in the wrong place