Garden Rooms Great Offer

dawnp_2

thanks for advice...my reply sent to CD was actually on those lines, informed them not 10% of original price, gave them copy of initial web listing with all prices showing...given them info on price comparison sites, both GR3 models had price reduced not just one i ordered etc...

However, my purchase was made in store, ordered by sales assistant on B&Q stock ordering system - SA confirmed price i paid was correct, and printed out receipt for order, so I did not have to wait for email confirmation of my contract.

Deputy manager at the store told me my order was cancelled and money refunded due to a "Quality problem" with Model GR3 garden room!!!!!!

I await their reply....... (but not holding my breath!!)

Silk

Hello Hello,
If it's ok with you I will post a few comments in bold in the quote as my reply its a bit easier than losing the track as you raise too many issues

Hello1234 wrote: »

Dropped by here because I'd been tipped off that the site might have some guidance about how to deal with my useless insurance company. What do I find? Twenty-five pages about a shed!! Quite enthralling actually.

I know this might make me unpopular by writing something contrary to common opinion but the bottom line is probably this. Do you expect B&Q to honour the agreement quietly? No. Then are you prepared to sue? Dunno about that. It's not a painless experience and not usually cheap.
To be honest the responses from B&Q have been very dissapointing and to be fair I doubt that some would consider it painfull nor expensive for individual's to go to the Small Claims Court if they feel the need to do so

MSE Wendy has given her opinion, and as she writes on behalf of Mr Lewis, there's a fair chance she's right about how this looks to be going. Before anyone else says this, I know the point she makes about online contracts being concluded when goods are delivered isn't quite right. This is a misconception as the major players often build it into their terms to avoid exactly this sort of discussion, e.g. Amazon etc.
Perhaps a quote from the Electronic Commerce (ec directive) regulations 2002 might clear this up :-

A clear notice stating among other things that your buyer's order constitutes an offer to buy the goods or services in question and the purchase contract is concluded at the point at which you send the receipt e-mail.

The contract is concluded once offer, acceptance, intention, capacity and consideration are in place. Most of you HAD concluded contracts when the email communicated acceptance and your cards were charged (re the terms), but there's two important issues:

(a) the terms allowing B&Q to cancel are not unfair. Because the same right is given to the customer. There is no imbalance here as you may equally cancel, for any reason, under the Distance Selling Regs.
The Distance Selling Regs are there to protect the consumer and give a cooling off period. It is not a "Tit For Tat" arrangement for the trader to apply the same rules.

(b) there is enough written evidence here to imply that many suspected a mistake, and that would present a strong case for B&Q to rescind. Next time I'd avoid posting your suspicions of mistake or sentiments of "too good to be true but I tried my luck anyway" in a public forum.
I'm sure you will agree that Courts deal with "facts" in individual cases and not what peoples opinions are on a public forum. To imply that B&Q would use evidence from any forum would be a little far fetched

Even if B&Q get told off by Consumer Direct for being careless, that doesn't mean you get a shed. It just means B&Q get a slap on the wrist.
Quite agree, however if some of the Agencies concerned were to find fault this can only add weight to individual cases as the only people who can force B&Q's hand is the Courts although B&Q may well be influenced by any investigation by those concerned.

Whatever the legality, perhaps B&Q have not acted fairly towards their customers? Maybe it's worth writing that letter of complaint and asking for a £10 voucher, at least that's a couple of paint brushes next time you do up the lounge.
I think for some people it has now gone a bit beyond "paint brushes".
Perhaps if a sincere apology had been given on day 1 or maybe even day 2 or 3 it might have sufficed but for it to have been dealt with in the way it has. I'm sure there are quite a number of customers who feel aggrieved by events


Don't hold out for much more. Deep down I think you really do know it's a non-starter.
I would have to say it's down to the individual and to stick with the facts which when presented correctly are very compelling which IMO means it's got legs.
Whether someone feels strongly enough to risk the probable cost of around £200 to run with it is the question

P.S. Once this has died down, if anyone knows how I can get my insurance company to pay out what they owe me I'd be much obliged for a point in the right direction.
Without knowing what the details are it would be very difficult for anyone to advise you so why don't you post up a request for help in the relavent section ?

Silk

dawnp wrote: »

thanks for advice...my reply sent to CD was actually on those lines, informed them not 10% of original price, gave them copy of initial web listing with all prices showing...given them info on price comparison sites, both GR3 models had price reduced not just one i ordered etc...

However, my purchase was made in store, ordered by sales assistant on B&Q stock ordering system - SA confirmed price i paid was correct, and printed out receipt for order, so I did not have to wait for email confirmation of my contract.

Deputy manager at the store told me my order was cancelled and money refunded due to a "Quality problem" with Model GR3 garden room!!!!!!

I await their reply....... (but not holding my breath!!)

Thats interesting with the "Quality Problem"
Rather naive of the Deputy Manager too, I wonder if Palladium are aware of the "quality issue" that has also now arisen.:D
I'm always rather saddened when companies use these sort of tactics when dealing with customers as it puts them in very bad light.

dawnp_2

yes, they are aware...i informed Palladium of B&Qs response to my cancelled order and their statement of it being a "Quality Problem".

Hello1234_2

Hi Silk,

You make some fair points and put them clearly. I'm on board with most but still think the online terms are fair. You write:

"The Distance Selling Regs are there to protect the consumer and give a cooling off period. It is not a "Tit For Tat" arrangement for the trader to apply the same rules."

I'd say that's debateable but B&Q refunds policy does state:

"If you return the item unused, with the original receipt within 90 days we will exchange the item or issue a refund based on the original method of payment, customer sales forms are an acceptable form of receipt."

On those grounds there's probably no imbalance as 90 days well exceeds the cooling off period. Unfortunately I cannot see, IMHO, any way forward for online purchasers as B&Q appear to have legitimate grounds to cancel.

As for the telephone and store buyers: you're right. It's a question of whether they are willing to invest c.£200 and a day off work to take their chance with small claims. I understand the courts will look at the facts and not hearsay but the question is not whether WE thought their was an error but if the 'reasonable man' thought so. In reality what that means is whether the judge thinks so - or that he/she has more reason that not (51%) to believe there was a obvious mistake.

So beyond writing letters, it might well come down to a £200 gamble on a judge's opinion if the desired outcome is to get the garden room.

Silk

Hello1234 wrote: »

I'd say that's debateable but B&Q refunds policy does state:

"If you return the item unused, with the original receipt within 90 days we will exchange the item or issue a refund based on the original method of payment, customer sales forms are an acceptable form of receipt."

On those grounds there's probably no imbalance as 90 days well exceeds the cooling off period. Unfortunately I cannot see, IMHO, any way forward for online purchasers as B&Q appear to have legitimate grounds to cancel.
.......................................................................................................
As for the telephone and store buyers: you're right. It's a question of whether they are willing to invest c.£200 and a day off work to take their chance with small claims. I understand the courts will look at the facts and not hearsay but the question is not whether WE thought their was an error but if the 'reasonable man' thought so. In reality what that means is whether the judge thinks so - or that he/she has more reason that not (51%) to believe there was a obvious mistake.

Hi Hello,
Just to reply to the two points you raise

Yes I agree the 90 days is more than acceptable for a returns policy. However that does still not justify or excuse them regarding their cancellation policy. How about an Insurance company that would pay out 100% of your claim if you had a fire but only pay out 50% if you had a flood ? Would that be acceptable because they had an excellent fire policy ?
Regarding the second point I agree there is an obvious risk in that it would depend on the Judge on the day, however the problem that B&Q will have is that not only did the customer think the price was correct but the staff who accepted the orders and the cash thought the price was correct and did not question it. The obvious reason for this is that the staff are used to processing orders that are heavily discounted and saw no reason to contest them.As an example I've been buying the £12 cases of wine at Sainsbury's and on two occasions the checkout staff have summoned the manager because it says "half price £29.97" on the box,The reason as they said was that it was unusual !

kippygirl

Hello1234 wrote: »

It's a question of whether they are willing to invest c.£200 and a day off work to take their chance with small claims...So beyond writing letters, it might well come down to a £200 gamble on a judge's opinion if the desired outcome is to get the garden room.

It's actually £108 for the court fee and no court outcome is guaranteed but this one is a pretty good "gamble". I'd say the chances of success are very high and I base this on Solicitor advice not forum speculation. If you're happy to represent yourself then it's the way to go. As for B&Q, the potential losses are far higher for them - do they want to take their chances with the court and run the risk of £108 plus customer's travel costs, loss of earnings for the day (limited to £50) plus cost of a plastic shed plus bad publicity plus (irrecoverable in any event) legal costs at £200 an hour or whatever B&Q's lawyers charge. It seems to me that the odds are very much stacked in the customer's favour although you seem very anxious to discourage anyone from going down the legal route (which I think is the only way that B&Q will actually supply these sheds).

rb_1947

kippygirl wrote: »

It's actually £108 for the court fee and no court outcome is guaranteed but this one is a pretty good "gamble". I'd say the chances of success are very high and I base this on Solicitor advice not forum speculation. If you're happy to represent yourself then it's the way to go. As for B&Q, the potential losses are far higher for them - do they want to take their chances with the court and run the risk of £108 plus customer's travel costs, loss of earnings for the day (limited to £50) plus cost of a plastic shed plus bad publicity plus (irrecoverable in any event) legal costs at £200 an hour or whatever B&Q's lawyers charge. It seems to me that the odds are very much stacked in the customer's favour although you seem very anxious to discourage anyone from going down the legal route (which I think is the only way that B&Q will actually supply these sheds).

Ditto, I'm certainly prepared to take it to a small claims court if it comes down to it. But then I can be very very persistent

I'm currently awaiting B&Q's response to my letter.

Trust_2

Very good points raised above, and honestly speaking I will not shy away from the courts, I the same as many others believed that this was a genuine offer, I want a Garden Office!

So lets wait and see!

Funkyfarmgirl

I wrote and compained to comsumer direct then i just left doing anything else and ive recieved a letter off my local county council from the trading standards service, not a lot said just they were lookin into the matter.