Understanding SSP. Please help.

snarffie

tigtag02 wrote: »

For the THIRD time (and thats just by me) she CANNOT work and claim SSP, no matter how many times you try to interperate HMRC's wording to make it fit what you want to hear!!!

A little rude, but thanks for your 'categorical' answer.

Rather than accept this as the final word, I have now discussed this matter with the advice centre which provides supoort for my partners illness, and the local citizens advice bureau person who deals with the subject.

I have been told that she can indeed claim SSP while working for two days in seven, as the PIW is 5 days in each week. Furthermore, as long as the number of hours worked in any period doesn't exceed the normal salary when combined with SSP, she can work more than the equivalent of half a week, although the CAB person said that stretching it to this extent would bring us into a 'grey area', whatever that means. I asked them if they are ABSOLUTELY sure that their advice is correct, and they have confirmed that it is.

To be honest, it is all pretty clear from the HMRC website, but nobody wanted to hear this no matter how many times I tried to point it out on this forum, although admittedly I didn't repeat myself THREE times. :rolleyes:

We have forwarded our findings to my partner's employer who have also done some research since last week, and they are happy to move forward on this basis.

dmg24 wrote:

The employer will not allow her to work if she has a 'full GP sick note'.

Insurance does not just relate to a person physically being in the building. The employer has a duty of care towards the employee, and they would be breaching this if they allowed her to work.

So you're telling me that any employee who returns to work before the period stated on their sick note will be sent home by their employer?

Snarffie

tooldle

Yes, the employer should not allow a return to work unless the GP has provided a certificate to allow the employee to return. Can't remember what it is called but it looks like the sick certificate and states that you are now certified as fit to work.
If you are going ahead with claiming ssp in this way, what happens when you reach the 28 week limit?

dmg24

snarffie wrote: »

A little rude, but thanks for your 'categorical' answer.

Rather than accept this as the final word, I have now discussed this matter with the advice centre which provides supoort for my partners illness, and the local citizens advice bureau person who deals with the subject.

I have been told that she can indeed claim SSP while working for two days in seven, as the PIW is 5 days in each week. Furthermore, as long as the number of hours worked in any period doesn't exceed the normal salary when combined with SSP, she can work more than the equivalent of half a week, although the CAB person said that stretching it to this extent would bring us into a 'grey area', whatever that means. I asked them if they are ABSOLUTELY sure that their advice is correct, and they have confirmed that it is.

To be honest, it is all pretty clear from the HMRC website, but nobody wanted to hear this no matter how many times I tried to point it out on this forum, although admittedly I didn't repeat myself THREE times. :rolleyes:

We have forwarded our findings to my partner's employer who have also done some research since last week, and they are happy to move forward on this basis.



So you're telling me that any employee who returns to work before the period stated on their sick note will be sent home by their employer?

Snarffie

You are really not getting this.

CAB are very good at giving generalist advice. You will find that, when you try to put this situation into practice, they are wrong. The fact that they have said that it is a grey area, yet they are ABSOLUTELY sure that they are correct (so contradicting themselves) says it all!

tooldle also raises an excellent point, what do you intend to do when you reach the 28 week point? If your partner has been off since October, this is only the end of next month!

I am not saying that every employer would send an employee home in this situation, but if they have a half decent HR dept then yes, they would. They have to consider their liability in this situation, and as such would be very irresponsible to allow the employee to work.

Several people have taken the time to give you informative and accurate information on this thread, for you to turn round and say that you don't believe them, just because it is not what you want to hear. Perhaps in future you could consider the precious time and effort that people put into their replies, before writing them off.

snarffie

dmg24 wrote: »

You are really not getting this.
CAB are very good at giving generalist advice. You will find that, when you try to put this situation into practice, they are wrong. The fact that they have said that it is a grey area, yet they are ABSOLUTELY sure that they are correct (so contradicting themselves) says it all!

Where did you read this!? What I actually wrote is this:

snarffie wrote:

I have been told that she can indeed claim SSP while working for two days in seven, as the PIW is 5 days in each week.

Noitce the FULL STOP at the end of the sentence?

The rest of the paragraph following that sentence refers to stretching the working hours towards a normal working week, then it would plainly be difficult to comply with the terms of the SSP policy. This is the grey area referred to.

tooldle also raises an excellent point, what do you intend to do when you reach the 28 week point? If your partner has been off since October, this is only the end of next month!

Again, you are not reading my original post! I said that she has been receiving SSP for TWO months.

Toddle's point was raised already by the CAB, and they say that my partner would have to claim incapacity benefit after 28 weeks. I didn't discuss this in any further detail, as we hope that she will be back in work at the end of the period covered by the GP note.

I am not saying that every employer would send an employee home in this situation, but if they have a half decent HR dept then yes, they would. They have to consider their liability in this situation, and as such would be very irresponsible to allow the employee to work.

This is a generalisation. If you were off work with flu, and recovered before the sick note was up, would your employer be reckless if they sent you home? Of course not! It goes without saying that it depends on the illness.
My partner is working from home. If a risk assessment was necessary, then I'm sure the employer would carry it out.

Several people have taken the time to give you informative and accurate information on this thread, for you to turn round and say that you don't believe them, just because it is not what you want to hear. Perhaps in future you could consider the precious time and effort that people put into their replies, before writing them off. Indeed, if you were so sure that you were right, I don't see why you posted in the first place?

Surely it would be foolish to proceed solely on the advice of this forum? I certainly appreciate the time people put into replying, and it is usually EXTREMELY useful to hear peoples thoughts, but this is a very important subject which I need to examine thoroughly. This is what a DISCUSSION forum is for.

You say that the information offered in this thread is 'accurate', which means that you dispute the advice from a CAB person who has already dealt with this situation before (I was VERY tenacious in asking if they were sure, as you can imagine). You also dispute the advice given by the benefits advisor in the charity that deals with my partners illness? My employer has even looked into it independently, coming to the same conclusion!

So that's three sources getting it wrong, but YOU, of course are right.

Look, I think this thread has come to a pretty sour conclusion, which is a first for me on MSE, so I'm happy to leave it at that. Thanks for your precious time.

Snarffie.

chrisbur

If your wife's employer's payroll department are unsure on SSP they can ring the employer helpline.

Employer Helpline
0845 714 3143

Open Monday to Friday 8am to 8pm
Saturday and Sunday 8am to 5pm
Expert advice given to established employers on PAYE, NIC, Statutory Sick pay, Maternity Pay, Tax Credits, Stakeholder Pensions, Student Loan Repayments and Construction Industry.

dmg24

chrisbur wrote: »

If your wife's employer's payroll department are unsure on SSP they can ring the employer helpline.

Employer Helpline
0845 714 3143

Open Monday to Friday 8am to 8pm
Saturday and Sunday 8am to 5pm
Expert advice given to established employers on PAYE, NIC, Statutory Sick pay, Maternity Pay, Tax Credits, Stakeholder Pensions, Student Loan Repayments and Construction Industry.

They'll probably be wrong too!

snarffie

chrisbur wrote: »

If your wife's employer's payroll department are unsure on SSP they can ring the employer helpline.

Employer Helpline
0845 714 3143

Open Monday to Friday 8am to 8pm
Saturday and Sunday 8am to 5pm
Expert advice given to established employers on PAYE, NIC, Statutory Sick pay, Maternity Pay, Tax Credits, Stakeholder Pensions, Student Loan Repayments and Construction Industry.

Thanks for that chrisbur. I already phoned this number in the hope that they might give info for employees too-they advised me to try CAB. My partner passed the number to her employers.

dmg24 wrote:

They'll probably be wrong too!

You tell me o wise one.

tooldle

I think you need to check the rules of the company occupational sick pay scheme. I have never yet come across an employer who does not use SSP as a contribution towards their occupational sick pay. This means that week 1 of SSP was in week 1 of the illness.

tigtag02

As dmg has said you really aren't getting this are you?!

With the greatest of respect to CAB they are wrong. There is only one way around this and even then I'm not sure if you would be teetering on the boundaries of legal let alone convincing your GP to actually do it!!

Your OH would have to have at least 6 QD (qualifying days) of the 7 available in one week. (This is because each linked sick period must be 4 days before SSP becomes payable and you say she will work 2 days (2+4 =6))

She would work 2 days and then need a sick note from the GP for the other 4/5 days EVERY WEEK

She would then be paid 2 days work and either 4 or 5 days SSP depending on the QD. This would equate to £48.37 or £51.82 respectively.

Every week would be linked so after 28 she would have exhausted her SSP entitlement.

To be honest I'm not even sure why I have even bothered explaining the above because you're not going to believe me BUT it's right.

Think about it ~ a sick note actually states *I examined you today and advised you that YOU SHOULD REFRAIN FROM WORK*. Is that not clear enough?!?!?!

Kasha

Tigtag02.... Is there any need to be so rude? No one has made you answer snarfie! If you cannot be polite with your answers and it bothers you so much that you repeat yourself three times then why bother answering?

Snarfie I sympathise with your dilemma, I too found SSP to be a complete nightmare AND HARD TO UNDERSTAND. alas we cannot all be super brains as far as SSP is concerned. Contrary to what Tigtag has said you actually can work and claim SSP LEGALLY....but.... that is if you have two jobs i.e. night taxi driver/day typist you break your leg can still work typist job and claim SSP from taxi job. So you see... you can be unfit for work and work!!;) Having said all that I don't think it will help your wife much I found the employee helpline very helpfull on 08453021479

Good luck
Kasha