Landlord sends repair bill without initial quote? What shall I do?

siliconbits

There's a sample letter I've prepared on Page 2 (http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=707021&page=2) .. Please view it and let me know what you think

My storage heater has a problem: sometimes, without any reason, it won't heat up - a real pain in winter obviously. It happens randomly. I've informed by landlord several times.

The first time, he sent someone but obviously since it is an economy 7 heater, it comes on only at night.

Second time around, heater didn't work for 2 days. Landlord sent another electrician. Electrician found nothing. Problem still persistent and we're leaving with it

Now landlord sent me a bill dated December 2008, (no mistake here). Here's verbatim what's written.

We have received a bill for XXX from our electricians for visiting you regarding the storage heaters. We pass this onto you as no fault was found please see electricians report below.

Call out to investigate fault with storage heater. After testing heater no fault was found on heater

Tenant was then explained how to use the storage heater correctly.

Questions: Is it legal that this bill was sent to me since I was never informed that I would have to pay in the first place?

Obviously, I don't get a kick out of calling the electrician each and every time to check a non-existant fault. The fault exists although it seems the electrician didn't find it for some reason.

What are my options?

chappers

The electrician was instructed by the landlord not by you, it is his job to check the situation first and not to rely on you.Its his problem.
also the problem may not be the heater but could be say at the meter.

chuckles1066

siliconbits wrote: »

My storage heater has a problem: sometimes, without any reason, it won't heat up - a real pain in winter obviously. It happens randomly. I've informed by landlord several times.

The first time, he sent someone but obviously since it is an economy 7 heater, it comes on only at night.

Second time around, heater didn't work for 2 days. Landlord sent another electrician. Electrician found nothing. Problem still persistent and we're leaving with it

Now landlord sent me a bill dated December 2008, (no mistake here). Here's verbatim what's written.

We have received a bill for XXX from our electricians for visiting you regarding the storage heaters. We pass this onto you as no fault was found please see electricians report below.

Call out to investigate fault with storage heater. After testing heater no fault was found on heater

Tenant was then explained how to use the storage heater correctly.

Questions: Is it legal that this bill was sent to me since I was never informed that I would have to pay in the first place?

Obviously, I don't get a kick out of calling the electrician each and every time to check a non-existant fault. The fault exists although it seems the electrician didn't find it for some reason.

What are my options?

As a tenant, not many :mad:

But seeing as the invoice is dated in the future, it'll take him a while before he can sue you for the value of it :beer:

wishiwasarichgirl

surely it's the landlords job to sort out problems?... ask him where in your contract it says it is the tennants responsibility.

chuckles1066

wishiwasarichgirl wrote: »

surely it's the landlords job to sort out problems?... ask him where in your contract it says it is the tennants responsibility.

The landlord has?

He's sent in an electrician who has found no fault and has invoiced him accordingly..........the landlord, quite rightly, has passed the bill onto the tenant.

Now I'm not saying the tenant is wrong when he/she claims the heaters aren't working but the landlord has acted appropriately.

There are plenty of landlords who wouldn't even bother checking it all out.......

siliconbits

The problem is that a heater is not like a bulb. It ain't as easy to sort it out. Also my grudge against my landlord hovers around the fact that a bill was sent without any prior agreement.

The issue is made worst by the fact that the heater appears to have a life of its own when it comes to heating up.

If I knew I would be charged for that, I would probably have purchased an oil heater from Argos...

chuckles1066

siliconbits wrote: »

The problem is that a heater is not like a bulb. It ain't as easy to sort it out. Also my grudge against my landlord hovers around the fact that a bill was sent without any prior agreement.

The issue is made worst by the fact that the heater appears to have a life of its own when it comes to heating up.

If I knew I would be charged for that, I would probably have purchased an oil heater from Argos...

They're very basic from memory......when I was 20 I had to put one together from scratch because the electrician bod didn't turn up :mad:

An electric current passed through a load of insulated bricks IIRC.....

siliconbits

chuckles1066 wrote: »

They're very basic from memory......when I was 20 I had to put one together from scratch because the electrician bod didn't turn up :mad:

An electric current passed through a load of insulated bricks IIRC.....

The problem, as far as I understand, is that when the time comes for the heater to turn on, at 2339, sometimes one can hear a distinctive metallic sound, like a flap opening or closing - which is when the heater normally turns on.

However, this doesn't always happen and I don't know exactly why.

paintpot

In my opinion as a landlord, anything a landlord supplies is the responsibiloty of the landlord to fix. The landlord can only charge the tenant if damage is caused by negligence or carelessness for example on the part of the tenant and the landlord would have to be able to prove this. Intermittent faults can be difficult to diagnose but it doesn't mean they don't exist. I would not expect my tenant to pay for this repair unless I could prove that they were at fault. In this case I don't think it is conclusive. As a landlord, in the first instance I would probably have visited the property and looked at the issue myself, read the instructions, maybe sought some advice if necessary and ensured the tenant was using the equipment properly before instructing an electrician. If the fault is persisting and you do not have adequate heating then the landlord should provide an alternative until the fault is diagnosed. However, the landlord has tried to his credit. Have a look at the clauses in your tenancy agreement but I don't reckon you should have to pay in this instance -the date on the invoice is just a typo so I wouldn't take alot of notice of that, an accurate version could easily be obtained.

However, I do believe landlords and tenants should have a good relationship, if you want to stay I would call him/her and have a sensible discussion about the issue with the heater first. Explain to the landlord exactly how you are using the heater and then he can be sure that you are using it correctly. Be calm and professional, don't let it become heated and take it from there, you can always post back.

lynzpower

chuckles1066 wrote: »

They're very basic from memory......when I was 20 I had to put one together from scratch because the electrician bod didn't turn up :mad:

An electric current passed through a load of insulated bricks IIRC.....

yes, but you cant tinker about with electrical FITTINGS unless you are qualified.

Thats not just advice, its legal. Thats why LLs have to employ electricians they dont just send round Mr Bodgeit ( well of course sometimes they do) and electricians have high call out charges.

YOU have no contract with that tradesman, either morally or legally. You never chose them nor did you phone them. If it was your opwn house the MSE in you should think OK ill call at least 3 tradesman and check the prices against each other. Indeed for court to approve a deduction from the deposit on a property, they have to priove, if questioned in court, that they had 3 written quotes ( not estimates) on headed paper for the trademan detailing the costs and the LL needs to prove he chose the cheapest. I was advised of this by the Private Sector Lettings Officer at a london council when an old LL was trying to take nearly 2ks worth of 3peoples deposits for a carpet clean and a new bulb a few years ago.

I would love to see where it is enshrined in law that the tenant pays the maintainence bills. My understanding is that all electrical, pliumbing and FIXTURES are the LLs reposibility for maintainence. Im sure we had a discussion on this very point only last week, so dig about a bit * think it was someone not getting their dep back* this is why MSE LLs are usually advised to rent unfurnished, less to maintain.

incidentally the first call out was utterly wrong. Economy 7 means that the electricity is used at night, for electrical storage, when electricity is more available and is thus slightly cheaper per unit. I used economy 7 in a flat i ownd with brand new storage heaters that were super efficient, but I also used heating in the day too!!! So I hope your LL isnt going to pay that or back charge that one to you as well, as I would be going straight to trading standards if I were him with a breach under the Sale of goods & services act. ( poor tradesmanship i think the clause is called)

Does your tenancy agreement make any references to this sort of thing?

the other aspecty is that if its still not working then neither tradesman should be paid, and your LL should be refusing on those grounds and standing shoulder to shoulder with you to get the blasted thinkg working or replace it, and to stop employing people without a clue what they are doing. :mad:

On a darker note, Id be a bit worried if your landlord seems to be running out of money :eek:

siliconbits

I am thinking of replying to the landlord by recorded delivery letter. I have been given 14 days from the 14th of December 2008 - don't ask me why they dated it 14/12/2008.

I am a bit wary that my £900 deposit is going to suffer when me and my wife leave the house (i.e. nit picking on anything that could cause charges to be deducted).

What tone shall I adopt, what will I have to put in the letter? Thanks guys!