A&L redefines 'Available'

MarkyMarkD

rob.jarvis wrote:

The cheque I paid in was displayed on the list of transactions. The Running balance included it, and so did the Available balance. BUT when I rang A&L they said although the Available balance includes the amount of the cheque, I was unable to spend it until 4/5 working days after it had been paid in (depending on how you interpret the T&C).

Eg. If I paid £100 in by cheque, when the cheque reaches A&L, they show the Available balance as £100, but I couldn't spend this money until it has cleared.

My complaint is that I think the Available balance should show what you could actually spend and not have to work out if cheques have cleared or not.

I'm not sure if I can make this any clearer.

While I'm on the gripe game, I've just noticed another thing in their T&C. It states, 'The central clearing cycle for the industry normally takes 3 Working Days for cheques and automated payments, however Our process takes an extra day.' Why?

What you have been told is not true. The available balance is the available balance and funds are not shown within that balance until the cheque has cleared. You don't have to work out for yourself whether cheques are deemed cleared.

You said in your OP that you were charged because you were caught out by this rule. That's the part which I don't believe on the basis of 8 years worth of experience banking with A&L.

MarkyMarkD

oldagetraveller wrote:

"Why?" I would suspect that they are just that little bit more greedy than the other banks and earn another day's interest, with your money, in some short term investment.

It's because A&L itself is not a clearing bank and cheques are sent from the branch (where you pay it in) to the clearing bank (A&L Commercial Bank, which was previously Girobank) at which point the standard clearing cycle starts. This adds one day to the cycle. A&L are not earning interest on the money during that additional day - as they haven't started clearing the cheque and haven't received it from the other party's bank. If you look at an A&L current account statement, cheques are always shown as being deposited the day AFTER the day they are paid in at the branch, for this reason.

MarkyMarkD

santana-mx3 wrote:

I've been caught out by A&L before. I've noticed on my running balance that I'm going to be short due money coming in being delayed. So I've done a transfer from my online saver. Online banking showed the savings amount go down and the current account amount go up and the transaction was shown in my running balance. I then made a payment. When I got my statement I found I was temporarily overdrawn at this time with an effect on interest. The reason: If you read through their T&Cs, it says you can only spend money which was in your account at the end of the PREVIOUS working day. How ridiculous. I never had that with Lloyds or Nationwide.

You might not have noticed or experience it with Lloyds or Nationwide but it is common to all banks. It just depends which order the batches of transactions are processed in (and, for transfers from savings to current accounts, whether they are done in real time or on a batch basis). If you don't have sufficient money in your current account at the end of the previous banking day, you run the risk of direct debits and cheques being bounced as these are generally cleared overnight - by any bank - on a batch basis.

I've NEVER been charged interest by A&L in the circumstances you describe - and I run my current account with a permanent zero balance by transfer to/from the online saver account. It sounds like you had some bad luck due to a delayed transfer but that doesn't quite stack up with you saying both sides of the transfer showed straight away.

BenL

I got caught out by the A&L batch jobs as well.

I run deficeit banking due to the free overdraft for the 1st year in conjunction with the online saver.

I put money across from the saver on sunday night exppecting that to be applied to my account first thing Monday before the debits occured.

This is what happens at abbey so 5 years of it you get used to it.

Anyway, the DD was paid and they slapped a £25 charge on.

A quick phone call and it was refunded.

I don't run as close to the limit anymore.

They do seem to be a little underhand things like this, reducing the kids account rates and online saver recently.

I don't want to switch my mortgage to them, god knows what things they will change in the future.

Ben

MarkyMarkD

Ben, you avoid the problem if you use an authorised overdraft limit with A&L and manage things within that. It doesn't work during the introductory 0% period, though, if you want to max out that free overdraft. As I've been with A&L for years I have never had the 0% so it doesn't affect me.

santana-mx3

MarkyMarkD wrote:

You might not have noticed or experience it with Lloyds or Nationwide but it is common to all banks. It just depends which order the batches of transactions are processed in (and, for transfers from savings to current accounts, whether they are done in real time or on a batch basis). If you don't have sufficient money in your current account at the end of the previous banking day, you run the risk of direct debits and cheques being bounced as these are generally cleared overnight - by any bank - on a batch basis.

I would definitely have expected to have trouble if I didn't have enough funds at the end of the previous day to cover the current day's direct debits as I would then be at the mercy of the order in which they chose to do credits and debits. What I was surprised at was that what appeared to be an instant transfer from my A&L savings account to my A&L current account didn't turn out to be cleared and available for a manual payment. Anyway, I know not to do it again.

I don't much care for A&L in terms of their online banking or their use of premium rate telephone numbers (especially when you have to phone an "activation line" for them to try and sell you card protection) but put up with them because of the interest and the free travel insurance. You can't have everything!

bluenose1

Hi,
I would consider involving the Financial Ombudsman as the balance info provided by A and L is misleading.
My mum has had terrible problems with A and L this year which despite several telephone call and letters were not resolved. Their interpretation of customer service is diabolical!!
I downloaded the Financial Ombudsman form, completed it and sent it. Within two weeks A and L apologised and refunded everything. Despite telling us on several occasions there was nothing they could do.
They make me mad
Love
Anne





I

rob.jarvis

I telephoned them this morning and asked if the Available balance is actually available to spend.

The answer was - A cheque received by A&L will show up on the Available balance on the 4th working day and up to £250 can be withdrawn on that day. The full amount of the cheque is not available until the 5th working day because, they say, sometimes the paying bank withdraw the cheque at the last minute on the 4th day, so A&L won't make it available until the next day.

So the bottom line is that a cheque paid in will show up on the Available balance on the 4th working day but is not fully available until the 5th working day.

That's the official line straight from the horse's mouth.