Belkin PureAV Home Theater Power Console PF30 - Surge suppressor

tr3mor

Alot of hifi kit comes with two pin euro plugs anyway. They're just put into an adapter plug to convert them to UK three pin sockets.

I know my amp and CD player are like this.

Good find, though it appears to have expired.

gromituk

Talksalot, can I see the report of the double-blind test you did, please? Otherwise, you have as much credibility as someone conducting a medical trial without using placebos, I'm afraid.

As I said - snake oil. Simple psychology: if you're told convincingly enough that something works (eg with pseudo-science like out of context references to oscilloscopes), you believe it does. And if you think you've got better ears and better hifi than anyone else, anything that questions this is interpreted as an attack on your very manhood (as man you surely are).

withabix

Pulled from Dell website.

They won't be getting delivered!

talksalot81

gromituk wrote: »

Talksalot, can I see the report of the double-blind test you did, please? Otherwise, you have as much credibility as someone conducting a medical trial without using placebos, I'm afraid.

As I said - snake oil. Simple psychology: if you're told convincingly enough that something works (eg with pseudo-science like out of context references to oscilloscopes), you believe it does. And if you think you've got better ears and better hifi than anyone else, anything that questions this is interpreted as an attack on your very manhood (as man you surely are).

Who needs a double blind test!? Connect up a scope to the raw mains and one to a device such as this - it doesnt need to be double blind, unless you are trying to tell me that an oscilloscope is capable of first knowing what is connected to it and second, changing its display as a result.

Mains filtering is scientifically sound. There is nothing more to it than that. If you go to a scientific facility, the mains supply is almost always 'cleaned' from the outside mains.

However, I suspect that you may be more of an expert than hundreds of thousands of experimental scientists who use this basic technology on a daily basis.

realitybites

Assuming it is 2 pin you can get a few here
http://cpc.farnell.com/jsp/Electrical,+Lighting+&+Security/Mains+Plugs+&+Adaptors/UNBRANDED/ECS2.5REWIRE-B/displayProduct.jsp?sku=CN06403

gromituk

talksalot81 wrote: »

Connect up a scope to the raw mains and one to a device such as this - it doesnt need to be double blind, unless you are trying to tell me that an oscilloscope is capable of first knowing what is connected to it and second, changing its display as a result.

But I thought that the purpose of this device was to make your hifi sound better - not to produce a prettier waveform on an oscilloscope? What you have told me is that you can see the effects of this on an oscilloscope (and I am interested in those so would welcome more details of what you have observed please, including figures, given that you are using a calibrated instrument).

Leaving aside arguments about the suitability of an oscilloscope to measure transient effects such as disturbances on the mains supply (it's designed to show regular occurrences, hence the name), what you are not telling me is that you can see/hear the effects on your video/audio - because you are not measuring it. It's like saying you can tell me how clear your tap water will be from the colour of the moorland stream feeding the reservoir. You can't. I'm afraid that you simply cannot draw those conclusions from those observations and you would be laughed out of court by any scientist or engineer. You are "measuring" (and I use that term advisedly) apples, and concluding pears.

The only way to measure the effects on the audio/video is to measure the audio/video themselves, which you are doing neither with an instrument nor with your own eyes/ears (via a double-blind test to compensate for the psychological effects of suggestion).

One could argue, and I've done this before, that if the "placebo effect" (suggestion) results in you thinking that your stuff looks/sounds better, then the cost of this device is money well spent. Fair enough, but don't try to pretend that there is any scientific basis to this, nor go on condescendingly about how you have to have a "decent" hifi system or you are better at noticing defects than anyone else. If the effect is psychological, quality of equipment and observational skills are out of the equation.

(Ironically, the better your audio/video equipment, the better its immunity from mains disturbances is likely to be, so the less effect any additional filtering is likely to have!)

Mains filtering is scientifically sound.

A true but abstract statement, meaningless in any particular situation unless all the facts are known. You simply don't know the facts - your hifi might have filtering quite good enough to get rid of any of the disturbances supposedly seen on your oscilloscope, rendering additional filtering unnecessary. Like I said - an overpriced extension lead.

If you go to a scientific facility, the mains supply is almost always 'cleaned' from the outside mains.

Tell me more. Give me some examples. Having worked in world-class laboratories dealing with video and audio, the most I've seen is noise-free earths - not something that this device supplies.

However, I suspect that you may be more of an expert than hundreds of thousands of experimental scientists who use this basic technology on a daily basis.

I am an engineer. I understand cause and effect, and am capable of logical reasoning. You are not displaying any evidence of scientific method, amateur or professional. Who are these "experimental scientists"? Do you mean purchasers of mains filters? Because as I have just explained to you, they are not scientists, they are people taken in by marketing.

jwruk

withabix wrote: »

Pulled from Dell website.

They won't be getting delivered!

I've just received an updated delivery date, so they'll be getting delivered at £9.96.

ScreechXL

Wow, Gromituk and talksalot81 are having a hum dinger of an argument.
In an attempt to lower your blood pressures I'll add my opinion.

Gromit Uk does have a point that people should be wary of spending hundreds of pounds on a device which they may not notice the effect of.

However in this case, the device costs less than £20, has a lifetime warranty, and protects a large range of the user’s appliances against power surges.

Also it acts to "purify" or "smooth" the electricity which the majority of the people on this forum won't notice the effect of (no offence). However if you have spent £1,000's on your dream hi-fi because you love hearing the increased detail in your music (i.e. not just buying a really loud one to annoy the neighbours) then believe me you will notice the difference. Especially if you live in a house where every time a large appliance switches on (freezer, fridge, tumble drier, boiler, etc) you get a loud click coming through the speakers - This unit does solve this.

Anyway none of this makes any difference as Dell have just cancelled both of my orders – and probably everyone else’s as well.

withabix

ScreechXL wrote: »

Anyway none of this makes any difference as Dell have just cancelled both of my orders – and probably everyone else’s as well.

LOL

I actually cancelled my order at the beginning of last week because of the euro-plug issue. When I phoned to cancel, the advisor told me at the time that all of these orders were going to get cancelled anyway (along with a orders for a lot of other Belkin stuff) beacuse of a pricing glitch on their system.

gromituk

ScreechXL wrote: »

However if you have spent £1,000's on your dream hi-fi because you love hearing the increased detail in your music (i.e. not just buying a really loud one to annoy the neighbours) then believe me you will notice the difference. Especially if you live in a house where every time a large appliance switches on (freezer, fridge, tumble drier, boiler, etc) you get a loud click coming through the speakers - This unit does solve this.

I'm afraid if you've spent £1000s on a hifi which is so badly designed that it is susceptible to the sort of mains-borne interference generated by such devices (and so easily removed by a few pence-worth of suppression components in a power strip) then you've been sold a pup.

And you don't have to spend £1000s on a hifi to be able to hear loud clicks, so you can't claim that it is its ability to reproduce increased "detail" (hmmm) that is responsible for you hearing them.