Towing in a car that has no Gross Train Weight

Ibrahim5

I was looking at a Skoda Kodiaq for towing. 190bhp 2 litre diesel 4x4. Should be capable of towing about 2300kg. The dealer confirmed that unless this £40k+ vehicle has been originally specified with approx £150 towbar prep then it would never be legal to tow anything. Strange situation.

fwor

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951143#Comment_81951143

I normally take what AI tells me with a grain of salt, but AI seems to be certain that a VIN plate is mandatory in the UK, but a load plate is only mandatory on goods vehicles.

Whatever, it's not relevant to the question of whether there is any explicit ban on towing a trailer with a car that has no defined GTW. As far as I can tell, there is none.

Herzlos

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951286#Comment_81951286

I think this is right actually, at least according to the minimal info on https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-weights-explained

The VIN plate is mandatory, but only 'usually' has the weights.

As for a legislative statement, I haven't found an act, but this gov site : https://www.gov.uk/towing-with-car/weight-and-width-limits

says quite clearly "If your VIN plate does not list a train weight, you should not use your vehicle for towing."

Though that implies you can't town at all even if there's a GTW in the handbook but not optionally on the VIN plate. But realistically if you get pulled by a traffic cop they'll only be looking at the VIN plate.

Herzlos

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951189#Comment_81951189

That's interesting, I'm assuming they mean that if it doesn't come with the prep, it doesn't get a GTW rating?

I'm curious as to what's actually involved in the towbar prep, because the £150 isn't going to cover the actual towbar. So I assume it's a wiring harness and potentially some towing mode software settings?

I can understand that, but that'll be a real pain for anyone buying 2nd hand to tow.

fwor

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951455#Comment_81951455

Yes - that was the .gov.uk statement that I quoted early on in the thread, along with a comment on the strangeness of the words "should not".

I think the closest guess so far is that the police will infer that if the manufacturer has not approved the car to have a GTW, the manufacturer does not endorse the use of the car for towing, which therefore invalidates the car's insurance.

WellKnownSid

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951458#Comment_81951458

On the Yeti (remember them?) it involved pre-wiring to the rear, software to turn things like reversing sensors off, and an extra electric fan on the radiator.

Herzlos

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951522#Comment_81951522

I had a Yeti and got a 3rd party towbar set up fine though I needed to disable the rear sensors every time with a button. I'm pretty sure it had a GTW on the VIN plate too.

Brilliant little cars, it's a shame they got dropped in favour of more SUV Crossovers.

Herzlos

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951470#Comment_81951470

True, I remember seeing 'should' come up already, sorry.

Assuming it's like the highway code, 'should' means that it's not an absolute offense itself but may constitute part of an offense or be used as evidence in one.

So my best guess is that 'towing' without a GTV isn't actually against any rules, but it's virtually impossible to do so without breaching the construction and use or GVW figures. In the same way I don't think it's technically illegal to add a 3rd axle to a car, but you're likely going to open a whole can of worms of other issues.

Like I said, I think it'd be a tough one to prove you were towing legally if stopped. So I wouldn't use a tow bar for anything other than a bike rack.

Mgman1965

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81948907#Comment_81948907

Wife has a car that is not type approved for towing, BUT, a towbar is available for it, BUT, states it is for mounting a cycle carrier ONLY, not for towing.

I'm sure it could tow a small camping trailer such as an Erde 102 perfectly OK (1.2ltr 98bhp), but if thete was an accident/incident or even a roadside check with an on the ball DVSA / Police officer who knows what the consequences would be.

Goudy

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81951743#Comment_81951743

Yes, that's the way I interpret it.

There are no specific laws for every eventuality, but there will be one law or another that could be used if needed. There are plenty of one rule, catch all type motoring laws.

For example, careless driving covers a whole host of different scenarios, there's not an individual law for each possibility. When it comes to enforcement, it comes down to level of proof if that particularly scenario meets the criteria or not.

In this case I think something like driving a vehicle in a dangerous condition could be applied. It might be argued the vehicles load weight or distribution causes a danger of injury or maybe it could be argued it's a illegal modification to that particular vehicle.

Now this is where proof comes in, you'll have hard work proving otherwise as the vehicle isn't rated at all for towing on our roads. The argument that a tow bar is available in another country isn't going to hold much weight in our courts.