Thermaflow Boiler - Wet Electric Heating Tariff

purkles

Hi, all the other posts about Thermaflow boilers are old so seeing if I can get any up to date info.

Moved into a property with an old broken RTS meter - it's not sending any data, but was a 'complex' multi-rate one with 3 rates.

Smart meter replacement booked for March.

Account with Scottish Power - currently on standard tariff so no exit fees if I need to leave.

No Gas - Thermaflow boiler with wet electric heating and no storage heaters.

So, what is the best tariff for these boilers? It seems like it will be ridiculously expensive, Scottish Power are not offering any tariffs with off-peak hours. Googling says in Scotland and at discretion they can offer the old domestic/economy 2000 tariff, but the customer complaints team denied any knowledge of it.

Help please.

matelodave

Most people will advise you to move as you really cant get a much more expensive way to heat your place than with an electric boiler.

TBH there's not really any sort of tariff that suits an electric boiler as you need to run it during peak times. Even an E7 tariff will only help for hot water overnight however heating the place using peak rates for the rest of the day will cripple you.

You'll be better off trying to change to storage heating and getting an off-peak tariff or exploring the cheapest fixed rate you can find.

Scot_39

Have a look at TOU like Octopus cosy or other smart TOU multirate deals if can avoid peak rate hours (4-7pm on cosy iirc) and home will retain heat for a few hours.

Edit : That is once get the new smart meter - and once you know its communicating reliably(*).

(*) SP users here have posted in past issues getting old arqiva comms to work in some rural and town areas - so it's not guaranteed. You might if lucky or if not and in a good vodafone 4g mobile area - be able to get one of the newer hubs that can use 4g cellular - if thats any better in your area

QrizB

Yes, I would also suggest Cosy Octopus as one of the better options for wet electric heating.

WiserMiser

If you're renting, move as soon as your agreement allows. If you own, consider High Heat Retention Night Storage Heaters such as Dimplex Quantum.

They're not cheap to buy but the running costs will be much lower and the property is likely to sell more easily when the time comes and fetch a higher price.

Ildhund

@purkles wrote:

Thermaflow boiler with wet electric heating ... what is the best tariff …?

This sort of arrangement seems to be quite common in Scotland, and it may have made sense before energy prices went haywire. The 'best' sorts of tariff would seem to be those that offer offpeak rates during the day when you need the heat. Economy 10 in Scotland (and North Wales!) appears to be the most sensible, since there's no dedicated heat storage involved (except perhaps for domestic hot water).

You didn't say which DNO area you're in; if it is Northern or Southern Scotland or Merseyside and North Wales (area ID 17, 18 or 13 on the map), you'd get three hours offpeak in the early morning (making for a nice warm house to get up to), another three in the afternoon to boost the temperature which could have fallen a lot, but also to do lots of other power-hungry stuff like electric showering, washing and drying, dishwashing, ironing, hoovering and so on at reduced rates. Then four hours after supper to keep you cosy in front of the TV and presumably make sure the bedroom is comfortable before turning in.

You may find that not many suppliers offer E10 up front, but it may be possible to persuade them that it's the only sort of plan you could afford.

gpman

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6656195/thermaflow-boiler-wet-electric-heating-tariff

Could you post an image of your meter set up please?

I've never seen or known of an RTS controlled smart meter before.

In regards your existing supplier, Scottish Power, they should be able to offer you a suitable alternative tariff if the existing RTS meter has failed (or indeed after installing a replacement smart meter)

They may try and fob you off with E7 which they do offer with a suitable meter, but it may not suit your requirements. Ensure you speak with their complex metering team; they should be able to best advise what they can offer you with a new smart meter.

Scot_39

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81892425#Comment_81892425

Ovo will now actually quote me online for E10 - I guess as its now more viable to support openly after they replaced at least some of their old SSE THTC RTS in N Scotland with E10 smart.

But with a modern - and importantly - reliably communicating - smets2 smart meter - cannot help but think something like TOU Cosy would work out cheaper - as long as dont use a lot of power in peak.

The rest of day and off peak rates would be much cheaper than E7 peak rates - and probably E10 peak and off peak rates (Ovo iirc wanted near 20p off peak for me - before the last electricity cap rise - 5% on single rate - another 4.3% on PC2 cap - in Jan)

matelodave

this is the Octopus Cozy tariff times and costs so you need to see whether you can adjust your heating, hot water and energy use around the off peak times avoiding the peak time when you want to cook your evening meal - https://www.octopriceuk.app/cosy Even the standard rate is a bit on the high side at 29p/kwh

Scot_39

Yes care needs to be taken when picking any complex or multirate tariff - it has to suit your own use profile - and heating requirements (ALCS or not being a major factor for some like me with old NSH)

The nearer 30p (which region guessing East from off peak comparison map?) is still favorable though to many E7 peak rates - see e.g. EDF current regional rates - around 34.5-37p higher on DD

https://www.edfenergy.com/sites/default/files/2023-12/DM1903_Standard%20%28Variable%29%2C%20Deemed%20and%20Welcome%20-%20standard%2C%20E7%20and%20prepayment%20meters_EPG%20rates.pdf

So if east

14.63 Cosy (inc VAT?) for 8 hrs split 3+3+2 vs 16.67 (inc VAT) for 7 hrs EDF off peak vs off peak - the importance of that split will depend on use and heating type - I suspect much better for OP set-up.

29.63 vs 36.42 - normal vs e7 peak

but need to avoid much - certainly any major warm up cycles - heating or hot water -

at the peak

36.42 E7 peak vs 44.74p Cosy peak - not so easy if kids back from school or workers returning from earlier ending shifts.

I'm used to dodging 4-8pm - as my E10 gives my off peak 1-4 and 8-10 - as did the EMEB RTS it replaced a decade ago (long before latest switch off panic) for heating and hot water only - so Cosy 4-7pm avoidance wouldnt be an issue for me. But it doesnt AFAIK come with the matching 8 hrs a day ALCS switching - which I need for my old lossy single off peak restricted wired NSH.

The SC also seems a little high - 48.39 vs 44 - but others have complained about other Octopus rates like Agile SC not reflecting recent drops (over last year my SVT MR SC down about 7p )

It appears as might be expected Cosy doesn't directly track the cap - there's no 5% increase in Jan - for instance. So like questions on other non SVT like their Agile - will it's pricing drop in April to reflect RO and ECO ?

Ildhund

I agree wholeheartedly with @Scot_39 when he writes:

… care needs to be taken when picking any complex or multirate tariff - it has to suit your own use profile …

It may also be a question of being able and willing to adapt the usage pattern to the tariff. Smart meter users have the advantage of being able to see precisely which loads would have to be shifted and which ones don't make much difference. I'm sure not many customers have the patience to go through all the calculations needed to discover the 'best' tariff, even though the difference could amount to hundreds of pounds a year.