They won't cancel my order

Grumpy_chap

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81881717#Comment_81881717

Maybe the OP should video themselves opening the damaged package so there is evidence the lamps arrived damaged and not damaged by the OP.

This would still leave the OP with the challenge of enforcing the full refund against a company that are seemingly non-compliant.

Okell

"For consumer purchases of standard stock items, statutory rights remain unaffected under the Consumer Contracts Regulations 2013, which allow a return within 14 days of delivery for eligible goods.

For our Returns Policy please click here.

(returns policy page makes no reference to statutory rights)"

(The above is meant to be an attempted quote from the end of @eskbanker's last post)

=======================================================

So the OP has two options depending on whether the lights are damaged or not.

If they are damaged then option 1 is for the OP to exercise the short term right to reject for a full refund (including delivery costs) under the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

Under this option the seller either has to arrange collection of the goods at their own cost, or pay for the OP to return them.

Under option 1 the OP gets a full refund and doesn't pay any return costs.

If the lights are undamaged then option 2 is for the OP to exercise her statutory right to cancel a distance contract under The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013.

The OP clearly informs the seller within 14 days of delivery that they are cancelling the contract and the OP returns the lights within 14 more days of informing the seller they are cancelling.

Who pays for that return depends on how far the seller's T&Cs comply with para 35 of The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013.

But if the seller's returns policy makes no reference to a consumer's right to cancel a distance contract under the 2013 regulations, I don't see how its returns policy cannot fall foul of the information requirement in para 35(5)(b) - meaning that the seller is responsible for the return costs.

If I were exercising option 2 I would speak to the seller and explain the above to them.

I would further tell them that I consider their attempt to impose a restocking fee and an admin fee on my cancellation was an illegal practice under consumer protection legislation insofar as it was obviously intended to deter me from exercising my statutory right to cancel the contract,* and that I wouldn't be paying it.

If the seller persisted in trying to prevent me from cancelling and/or trying to make me pay an admin and a restocking fee, I'd tell them they left me no choice but to refer their T&Cs and returns policy to Trading standards for investigation*.

Whether all that would work or not against an obviously dodgy retailer I don't know, but that's the approach I'd take if I were the OP.

*I suspect the seller's imposition of an admin fee and a restocking fee would have amounted to a criminal offence under The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 and I assume tit still would under the new Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024

KaratePigeon

Ok I've opened them (got my daughter to video it) and I'm not happy with them. The packaging wasn't an issue really as they were in their own (undamaged) boxes inside. But all 3 have slight damage to the coating - tbh it wouldn't notice once they were up and if I'd paid what I expected I would have lived with it but they look really cheap and not worth what I paid. Maybe they are seconds? I've tried to take a photo of the fault but it doesn't show up that well - I'm not convinced it's bad enough to get a full refund based on that?

Grumpy_chap

You don't need there to be a fault to obtain a refund. You have consumer rights to return for any (or no) reason within 14 days of receipt.

As the thread has established, having rights and enforcing rights may be quite another thing.

I am sure others will comment, but I would respond now that you are cancelling the order under the CCR and will return for a full refund.

Okell

As has already been explained, if the lamps aren't damaged you can still exercise your statutory right under para 29 of The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 to cancel a distance contract within 14 days of delivery.

You clearly inform the seller in writing (email should do) that you are cancelling the contract as per the above regulations. You then have a further 14 days in which to send the lamps back to the seller.

If you cancel the contract the law does not allow the seller to impose any sort of fee - admin, restocking or otherwise - on you, and it's perhaps a criminal offence for them even to try to do so. (Although I'm not 100% sure of that last bit) [Edit: Having looked at Part 4 chapter 1 of the Digital Markets, Competition and Consumers Act 2024, I suspect it could be deemed an Unfair commercial practice.]

Depending on exactly what the seller's T&Cs and returns polciy say, you may or may not have to pay the return costs.

Basically, you will need to pay the return cost if the seller has told you in their T&Cs or returns policy that you "will have to bear the cost of returning the goods in case of cancellation and, … if the goods, by their nature, cannot normally be returned by post, the cost of returning the goods". (See para 35(5)(b) and para (m) of Schedule 2 of the above linked Regulations for the detail)

If the seller has not told you that information, then the law says that the seller must pay the return costs.

My software won't let me access the seller's website so I don't know what they've told you, but I think @eskbanker has previously said that the seller's returns policy makes no mention of your statutory right as a consumer to cancel a distance contract. If that is the case then I don't see how - if they don't even mention your right to cancel - they can have told you that you must pay the return cost if you do cancel.

If that is right then they should pay the return cost.

The problem you have is that although you may have legal rights here, your seller sounds as if they might make it very difficult for you to exercise those rights in practice.

I think if I were you I'd be inclined to phone them and say you are thinking of exercising your statutory right as a consumer to cancel a distance contract, and that as you think they are in breach of their legal obligation to provide certain information about the return costs required by the Regulations, you think that they must pay the return costs. Ask them for confirmation that they will pay the return costs if you cancel, and how they will arrange that.

See what they say to that.

eskbanker

My software won't let me access the seller's website so I don't know what they've told you, but I think @eskbanker has previously said that the seller's returns policy makes no mention of your statutory right as a consumer to cancel a distance contract. If that is the case then I don't see how - if they don't even mention your right to cancel - they can have told you that you must pay the return cost if you do cancel.

The post is on the previous page but to be clear, they do mention the statutory right to cancel (albeit not actually using the word 'cancel' and missing all the key details) within their Ts & Cs (as quoted), but not on the (separate) returns policy page itself.

Okell

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81882987#Comment_81882987

OK, thanks

But do they say that if a consumer exercises their right to cancel then the consumer must pay the return costs?

eskbanker

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81883009#Comment_81883009

No, the wording is solely as quoted here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81881797#Comment_81881797

KaratePigeon

Just reading their damaged goods policy:

that doesn't seem legal either? I don't want a replacement :( it was delivered 24 hours ago but since they aren't open Saturday I feel like I need to tell them now if I'm going to.

KaratePigeon

Why is there 14 days to return if you don't like it but only 48 if it's damaged, I'm so confused.

I really appreciate the advice, though I don't understand a lot of the terms.

But I think I need to contact them now, ask for a return address and tell them I will cover postage (can I just do this the cheapest way possible, or am I stuck with what courier they use?) but that it's illegal for them to change me any other fees?