Reduction to existing fix rates from April - will there be a cut off date for signing up?

jbuchanangb

During the time of the Energy Price Guarantee, the unit rate for my fixed tariff (EON Next Online v15) was unchanged, but a discount was applied to that unit rate. Might not a similar mechanism be used to apply this new reduction whatever it is going to be called. I started a new 18 month fix on 2 February. (EON Next Fixed 18m v27)

Scot_39

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81872290#Comment_81872290

I can just here the arguments over average vs median when that one comes clear when Ofgem announce their Apr rates in c3 weeks time - and those claiming they were robbed of that £16 difference

And I bet you as usual thats the duel fuel cap savings level - ignoring the c15% of those who are off gas grid - millions on the higher PC2 electric median TDCV (3900 kWh vs 2700 kWh for duel fuel electric cap).

tfhnota

I am sure that Ofgem, as always, will favour the consumer over the energy retailer and use whichever figure works out best for Joe Bloggs and even squeeze the energy retailer for a bit of extra savings; their concern for the consumer has an almost religious zeal!

MWT

Personally I'm expecting £0 and I'm happy with that.

I don't use peak-rate electricity at all, so not expecting to see any savings.

Scot_39

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81873057#Comment_81873057

Why would some of the costs moved not apply to the profile class 2 cap - and so hopefully at least to some extent - impact both peak and off peak rates ?

Of course given history - like during EPG era - maybe similar issues could repeat.

e.g. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64332617

IIRC my supplier EOn Next was slated in one region one post - forthe forumites E7 off peak rate jumping up 17% in one post here.

I can see lots of letters and campaigns from energy charities - just as their were during the crisis then - on the way E7 customers tariffs interacted with EPG discount changes - if they dont benefit properly. Not that I suspect anything changed for those paying more that quarter.

And perhaps some of the large disparity on the govts RO simple average vs cap tdcv - is the difference in consumption between duel fuel and PC2 users - at median TDCV as govt reduced £67 figure - 3900/2700 = 44% more energy

If did get applied and distributed equally per average unit at cap level - 1.44*£67 (around 2.5p/kWh) = £96.

But there is the risk it wont get split equally then as you suggest - to off peak / peak rates - the see-saw tilted as it were.

Swipe

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81873702#Comment_81873702

I bet Snug still stays at 9p off peak rate

Scot_39

To be fair I am not sure what tariff MWT is on - is it Snug ?

But E7 is an Ofgem regulated - if not quite universally mandated (there ws a small customer base opt out at one stage iirc) - and has the Ofgem PC2 cap to cover it - Snug isn't

They produce the less widely publicised PC2 multirate cap quarterly - and still refer to E7 in it's calculation assumptions - the 42% night mix for instance.

I didnt look that closely at Snug vs E7 day rates in Jan - but iirc in Oct - the day rate increased by a little more than their E7 - when both E7 rates went up.

As I said above - there is lots of doubt - on non standard tariffs.

I for one wasnt aware of the lack of a level playing field one of the (ECO?) components.

Hardly fair to other suppliers - if means they can offer bills £60+ cheaper at no cost to themselves.

And from the ldhund extract from budget post above - you can see that looks like they really have only looked at the duel fuel cap equivalent figures.

So my if applied to E7 at 1.44 - is in itself pretty much just speculative.

I just think there will be political implications if E7/E10 etc users do not benefit.

Given it is they who face generally most of the recent and predicted govt policy cost increases being built into electricity rates.

MWT

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81873781#Comment_81873781

IOG, hence not expecting anything from this change, but yes, SVT E7 should see something on both sides of the line due to the way the cap works, but for anything other than the capped tariffs there is nothing preventing the supplier from only reducing the peak rate for example.

Ildhund

There may be something I'm not understanding here, but that's nothing new. Looking at Ofgem's background material for their incredibly convoluted price calculations, I see in Annex 4's Aggregate costs tables that ECO would have been expected to cost each supplier in the scheme £8.91/MWh of electricity supplied and £3.15/MWh of gas. Similarly, the Renewables Obligation costs the supplier £33.06/MWh of electricity supplied. If 3/4 of that is to be met by the Treasury, that's another £24.80/MWh off the suppliers' bills.

For each electricity customer, the relief should be £8.91 + £24.80 = £33.71/MWh or - in ordinary energy bill terms, 3.3710p/kWh off the bill.
For gas customers, £3.15/MWh is 0.3150p/kWh off the bill. There may be some losses to be accounted for, but these quantities are specifically labelled £/MWh supplied, so I'd take that to be net of transmission/distribution losses.

This isn't far off the 3.5p/kWh figure we've seen for a 'typical' dual-fuel customer, but I'll leave it to the reader to work that out. I can't see any complication introduced by ToU tariffs or anything else: if the supplier is to pass on all the savings to the consumer, it's a straight discount per unit supplied. I'm sure Ofgem will be watching to see how suppliers balance the discount between different ToU rates.