Octopus EV charging rip-off coming end January

matt_drummer

OK, makes sense.

The same end result though.

They say six hours of ev charging plus 23.30 to 05.30 at the cheap rate plus any house use in the 05.31 to 23.29 period at the cheap rate if the ev is charging.

Presumably you'll only get the cheap rate in the 05.31 to 23.29 period if you haven't already had your full six hours of ev charging.

MeteredOut

matt_drummer said:

OK, makes sense.

The same end result though.

They say six hours of ev charging plus 23.30 to 05.30 at the cheap rate plus any house use in the 05.31 to 23.29 period at the cheap rate if the ev is charging.

Presumably you'll only get the cheap rate in the 05.31 to 23.29 period if you haven't already had your full six hours of ev charging.

Not exactly the same result - the car/charger reported usage will not include charging losses (which can be ~20% for 3-pin chargers).

The announcements have stated that any EV charging > 6 hours will be charged at peak rate, even in 23:30-05:30, which is why I've questioned how they're going to do that, and landed on the only way i think they can (via account credit).

And there's a possible workaround for those that charge directly via their car - by turning off smart charging and simply charging via their car controls in 23:30-05:30. Whether Octopus could recognise that via the car integration, I'm not sure.

matt_drummer

MeteredOut said:

Not exactly the same result - the car/charger reported usage will not include charging losses (which can be ~20% for 3-pin chargers).

Doesn't it?

I am pretty sure my charger records the electricity it has consumed, not how much made it to the car's battery.

MeteredOut

matt_drummer said:

MeteredOut said:

Not exactly the same result - the car/charger reported usage will not include charging losses (which can be ~20% for 3-pin chargers).

Doesn't it?

I am pretty sure my charger records the electricity it has consumed, not how much made it to the car's battery.

Yes, but for car integration (rather than charger integration) the Octopus -> EV integration reports what the car sees, which from my experience, is what was loaded into the battery, not what was consumed.

Since Octopus cannot see what the charger has recorded, it can only use what is reported to it from the car integration. This is what is shown in the Octopus App today under Charge Insights.

EDIT: as an example, for a charge I did last week, the charger app reported 44.10kWh but the Octopus app shows 37.62kWh. This is a 3-pin charger (albeit a "smart charger" with an app) and the car is EV integrated to Octopus, not via the charger.

matt_drummer

I think we have been here before, it was you or somebody with a similar username.

If what goes to the car is what is used to determine the credit, then you will get credited for the charging losses.

You would be charged full rate and then credited for all usage other than what went in the car.

You would get the charging losses at the cheap rate between 23.30 and 05.30 even if you had exceed the six hours ev charging.

Either way, you won't be losing anything or paying for any non ev charging at the higher rate between 23.30 and 05.30

matt_drummer

MeteredOut said:

EDIT: as an example, for a charge I did last week, the charger app reported 44.10kWh but the Octopus app shows 37.62kWh. This is a 3-pin charger (albeit a "smart charger" with an app) and the car is EV integrated to Octopus, not via the charger.

Then you would get 6.48kWh, your charging losses, at the cheap rate whatever.

Whichever billing method they choose, directly or with a credit, in your example you will only pay for 37.62kWh at the higher rate assuming it all exceeded the six hours allowed.

MeteredOut

matt_drummer said:

I think we have been here before, it was you or somebody with a similar username.

If what goes to the car is what is used to determine the credit, then you will get credited for the charging losses.

You would be charged full rate and then credited for all usage other than what went in the car.

You would get the charging losses at the cheap rate between 23.30 and 05.30 even if you had exceed the six hours ev charging.

Either way, you won't be losing anything or paying for any non ev charging at the higher rate between 23.30 and 05.30

Agreed, the under-reporting of what is used versus what reaches the car would mean a cheaper bill since more would be charged at the house rate.

But, i'm not sure Octopus to explained how the billing would work - If my assumption is correct, it's actually quite a big change for customers.

matt_drummer

It doesn't matter,

In your example 37.62kWh went to your car and that is all Octopus know about.

They either charge 37.62kWh at the higher rate (which you say the cannot do) or charge all use at the higher rate and credit all of it minus 37.62kWh at the difference.

The end result is the same in your example.

Which is where we started out, it doesn't matter how they do it in your case.

I don't see any big change for most people, who needs more than six hours of charging a day, assuming a wall charger is used.

For those that use granny chargers, more of an issue

born_again

matt_drummer said:total is 

I think we have been here before, it was you or somebody with a similar username.

If what goes to the car is what is used to determine the credit, then you will get credited for the charging losses.

You would be charged full rate and then credited for all usage other than what went in the car.

You would get the charging losses at the cheap rate between 23.30 and 05.30 even if you had exceed the six hours ev charging.

Either way, you won't be losing anything or paying for any non ev charging at the higher rate between 23.30 and 05.30

Interesting stats from today
Octopus now are showing charging data on your home page.
Just added 20% this morning.
Octopus says 14.05 kWh used
OHME says 14.9 kWh used

E-Niro so battery is 64.8 usable or 68 total

So 20% of usable is 12.96 kWh, total would be 13.6 kWh.
Car is showing a start of 47% & end of 67%...

bigpops

Good news, readers.
Octopus have just offered to alter their charging app so that we can choose to only accept 6 hours of EV charging per night. This will be alongside the current option to choose the amount of charge and time to finish.
For those awake enough to choose the new option you will avoid the chance of Octopus charging full rate for EV charging, at their discretion.
In 6 hours I can get up to 150 miles of charge.
If I were to need  a full 300 miles of charge in one night this will cost about three time as much as currently.
According to Octopus' own figures, one in five customers will be hit by these extra charges.
Shame on you, Octopus.