Unfair dismissal with redundancy and unemployment insurance

Fedcas65

Hello,

I've been unfairly dismissed in my redundancy process, no questions, but I do have an unemployment insurance.
Now, it makes me think that my insurance will investigate if it's unfair or not, because they wouldn't normally insure an unfair dismissal.
I didn't see it written anywhere, but I'm pretty sure it'll go in this direction.

So, here I risk do not take a penny from my insurance that I kept paying since a long time.
Does it make sense to challenge the company anyway in 5 days after the termination of employment, so at least the judge "one day" can decide who will need to pay my unemployment? This can happen in 2y distance...

Obviously, the company would be liable for more, but my focus is on getting at least something one day...

Ayr_Rage

Your post is not clear.

Do you think you have been unfairly selected and subsequently made redundant?

Were you paid redundancy money? 

Do you think you have been unfairly dismissed?

Were you given notice?

How long were you employed?

Are you a member of a Trades Union?

That's the best place to get advice.

Your insurance will ask for the reason you are now unemployed to see if you are eligible under the policy but I cannot see them investigating what has happened.

Fedcas65

Ayr_Rage said:

Your post is not clear.

Do you think you have been unfairly selected and subsequently made redundant?
Absolutely, after a consultation in private there is no doubt.

Were you paid redundancy money? 
Yes

Do you think you have been unfairly dismissed?
Absolutely, after a consultation in private there is no doubt.

Were you given notice?
Yes

How long were you employed?
More than 2y, but that doesn't matter now

Are you a member of a Trades Union?
No, should I? I'm planning to request help for free by some association, as pursuing this in private is around 20k, believe it or not, and that's just the starting point

That's the best place to get advice.

Your insurance will ask for the reason you are now unemployed to see if you are eligible under the policy but I cannot see them investigating what has happened.

You find the answers in bold above

Ayr_Rage

Fedcas65 said:

Ayr_Rage said:

Your post is not clear.

Do you think you have been unfairly selected and subsequently made redundant?
Absolutely, after a consultation in private there is no doubt.

Were you paid redundancy money? 
Yes

Do you think you have been unfairly dismissed?
Absolutely, after a consultation in private there is no doubt.

Were you given notice?
Yes

How long were you employed?
More than 2y, but that doesn't matter now

Are you a member of a Trades Union?
No, should I? I'm planning to request help for free by some association, as pursuing this in private is around 20k, believe it or not, and that's just the starting point

That's the best place to get advice.

Your insurance will ask for the reason you are now unemployed to see if you are eligible under the policy but I cannot see them investigating what has happened.

You find the answers in bold above

So you have not been dismissed but made redundant and you believe you were unfairly selected.

That's an entirely different ballgame to unfair dismissal.

You may get advice for free but as you are not a union member getting someone to take on your case is going to cost you.

p00hsticks

and there is no point in joining a Trade Union now and expecting them to help and advise on something that took place before you joined... they won't.

Fedcas65

p00hsticks said:

and there is no point in joining a Trade Union now and expecting them to help and advise on something that took place before you joined... they won't.

Really? And how I was supposed to predict the future?

So I can't join any "free" organization now?
I mean, I can even pay but in private they asked me 20k just to start, that's crazy...

I'm still employed but not for a long time, am I still in time?

QrizB

Fedcas65 said:

p00hsticks said:

and there is no point in joining a Trade Union now and expecting them to help and advise on something that took place before you joined... they won't.

Really? And how I was supposed to predict the future?

Much as you can't take an insurance policy after the event has happened, Trade Unions won't help with things that happen before you join.

I joined the TU in my workplace quite soon after joining.

Fedcas65 said:

So I can't join any "free" organization now?

TUs aren't generally free; you pay a subscription.

Fedcas65 said:

I'm still employed but not for a long time, am I still in time?

You can join, but they won't usually help you with anything that happened prior to your date of joining.

Fedcas65

QrizB said:

Fedcas65 said:

p00hsticks said:

and there is no point in joining a Trade Union now and expecting them to help and advise on something that took place before you joined... they won't.

Really? And how I was supposed to predict the future?

Much as you can't take an insurance policy after the event has happened, Trade Unions won't help with things that happen before you join.

I joined the TU in my workplace quite soon after joining.

Fedcas65 said:

So I can't join any "free" organization now?

TUs aren't generally free; you pay a subscription.

Fedcas65 said:

I'm still employed but not for a long time, am I still in time?

You can join, but they won't usually help you with anything that happened prior to your date of joining.

Thanks a lot, I hope I can get help there.

But overall, how someone is supposed to know it?

I've been in 4 companies and I've never heard of those things, I thought that those organizations were dead in UK... (I come from the other side of the sea in EU and I've heard of these organizations only in history... Seriously... In my country they still operate though and they do quite a lot, but I didn't hear anything about UK)

Isthisforreal99

Fedcas65 said:

QrizB said:

Fedcas65 said:

p00hsticks said:

and there is no point in joining a Trade Union now and expecting them to help and advise on something that took place before you joined... they won't.

Really? And how I was supposed to predict the future?

Much as you can't take an insurance policy after the event has happened, Trade Unions won't help with things that happen before you join.

I joined the TU in my workplace quite soon after joining.

Fedcas65 said:

So I can't join any "free" organization now?

TUs aren't generally free; you pay a subscription.

Fedcas65 said:

I'm still employed but not for a long time, am I still in time?

You can join, but they won't usually help you with anything that happened prior to your date of joining.

Thanks a lot, I hope I can get help there.

But overall, how someone is supposed to know it?

I've been in 4 companies and I've never heard of those things, I thought that those organizations were dead in UK... (I come from the other side of the sea in EU and I've heard of these organizations only in history... Seriously... In my country they still operate though and they do quite a lot, but I didn't hear anything about UK)

So who do you think is driving the NHS doctors strike? Yes the union so they are far from dead.

p00hsticks

I don't think as many employers as used to formally recognise Trade Unions for use in collective wage negotiations etc - if your last employer had done, then it would most likely have been the Trade Union representative representing the employees in the redundancy consultations  (assuming that more than 20 people were made redundant). 

However there is nothing to stop an individual joining one and seeking their help if and when required. 

But as others have said it works like insurance - you can't just join if and when you need help, you need to be a member before the event happens 

MyRealNameToo

Fedcas65 said:

QrizB said:

Fedcas65 said:

p00hsticks said:

and there is no point in joining a Trade Union now and expecting them to help and advise on something that took place before you joined... they won't.

Really? And how I was supposed to predict the future?

Much as you can't take an insurance policy after the event has happened, Trade Unions won't help with things that happen before you join.

I joined the TU in my workplace quite soon after joining.

Fedcas65 said:

So I can't join any "free" organization now?

TUs aren't generally free; you pay a subscription.

Fedcas65 said:

I'm still employed but not for a long time, am I still in time?

You can join, but they won't usually help you with anything that happened prior to your date of joining.

Thanks a lot, I hope I can get help there.

But overall, how someone is supposed to know it?

I've been in 4 companies and I've never heard of those things, I thought that those organizations were dead in UK... (I come from the other side of the sea in EU and I've heard of these organizations only in history... Seriously... In my country they still operate though and they do quite a lot, but I didn't hear anything about UK)

It's not about knowing, it's about wanting to transfer the risk. You can't buy life insurance on someone who just died, you buy it whilst they are alive and if they die during the term you get paid out more than you paid in and if they survive you dont get paid anything. 

Not sure which EU country you hail from but a good number of countries there have more vocal TUs than in the UK and other considerations like Works Councils. 

You simply decide in advance, do you want to pay a fee to be a member of a trade union and hope that they help protect your interests through collective bargaining etc or do you want to save the fees and deal with matters yourself. 


For redundancy the insurance will generally only be looking to see if it was voluntary or compulsory, they dont pay out if you offered to go. Unless you start taking legal action about being unfairly selected they won't challenge how you were selected if its clear you didnt volunteer