NHS pension loss after less than two years employment

Dazed_and_C0nfused

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Hi all, looking for some advice here.

Long story short, I've recently learned that for entitlement to an NHS pension, you must be employed for over two years. In my situation, I was employed for one year and contributed the whole time.

My understanding as of now is that I had a 12month time frame to transfer my pension contributions out (including NHS employer contributions), otherwise I lose the right to employer contributions.

This was not communicated to me at the time I left the organisation, and as a result I have lost 13 months worth of employer contributions from the NHS. I asked the NHSBSA for written correspondence where this was explained to me, but they instead directed me towards their complaints procedure (which I think says it all).

Has anyone else lost out on thousands of pounds because of this? And any advice on how to proceed?

Thanks in advance for any help

What has happened to your own contributions?

I can get a refund of my own contributions. It's the NHS contributions which I've missed out on

You will be even more disappointed then as it's actually a refund of your own contributions less 20% tax.  And the tax is non refundable, even if you have low income and haven't used your Personal Allowance.

But if you haven't actually had the refund yet then are you sure you have missed the boat for a transfer to another pension (of both your contributions and the employer ones?)

Swinton1050

Lemon_dr1zzle said:

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Hi all, looking for some advice here.

Long story short, I've recently learned that for entitlement to an NHS pension, you must be employed for over two years. In my situation, I was employed for one year and contributed the whole time.

My understanding as of now is that I had a 12month time frame to transfer my pension contributions out (including NHS employer contributions), otherwise I lose the right to employer contributions.

This was not communicated to me at the time I left the organisation, and as a result I have lost 13 months worth of employer contributions from the NHS. I asked the NHSBSA for written correspondence where this was explained to me, but they instead directed me towards their complaints procedure (which I think says it all).

Has anyone else lost out on thousands of pounds because of this? And any advice on how to proceed?

Thanks in advance for any help

What has happened to your own contributions?

I can get a refund of my own contributions. It's the NHS contributions which I've missed out on

Why do you think you should be refunded your employer contributions? 

I think in terms of the legality or i think in terms of it being unfair?

Legality wise I presume I dont have a leg to stand on and I didn't pay enough attention.

But I think it's unfair that they dont communicate the 12 month time limit when you leave the organisation, and just because it was less than 2 years I dont think should determine whether you lose the contributions or not.

And being technical I wouldn't expect a refund of the contributions but more a right to transfer into another pension.

Sorry if I didn't answer your question let me know.

Swinton1050

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Hi all, looking for some advice here.

Long story short, I've recently learned that for entitlement to an NHS pension, you must be employed for over two years. In my situation, I was employed for one year and contributed the whole time.

My understanding as of now is that I had a 12month time frame to transfer my pension contributions out (including NHS employer contributions), otherwise I lose the right to employer contributions.

This was not communicated to me at the time I left the organisation, and as a result I have lost 13 months worth of employer contributions from the NHS. I asked the NHSBSA for written correspondence where this was explained to me, but they instead directed me towards their complaints procedure (which I think says it all).

Has anyone else lost out on thousands of pounds because of this? And any advice on how to proceed?

Thanks in advance for any help

What has happened to your own contributions?

I can get a refund of my own contributions. It's the NHS contributions which I've missed out on

You will be even more disappointed then as it's actually a refund of your own contributions less 20% tax.  And the tax is non refundable, even if you have low income and haven't used your Personal Allowance.

But if you haven't actually had the refund yet then are you sure you have missed the boat for a transfer to another pension (of both your contributions and the employer ones?)

Yeah I understand that tax and NI are charged when refunded - hence my ultimate goal was to transfer.

But unfortunately the NHSBSA confirmed I can not transfer since over 12 months have passed. They actually give me incorrect information in one email saying I was able to, only to correct this further into the conversation. 

Dazed_and_C0nfused

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Hi all, looking for some advice here.

Long story short, I've recently learned that for entitlement to an NHS pension, you must be employed for over two years. In my situation, I was employed for one year and contributed the whole time.

My understanding as of now is that I had a 12month time frame to transfer my pension contributions out (including NHS employer contributions), otherwise I lose the right to employer contributions.

This was not communicated to me at the time I left the organisation, and as a result I have lost 13 months worth of employer contributions from the NHS. I asked the NHSBSA for written correspondence where this was explained to me, but they instead directed me towards their complaints procedure (which I think says it all).

Has anyone else lost out on thousands of pounds because of this? And any advice on how to proceed?

Thanks in advance for any help

What has happened to your own contributions?

I can get a refund of my own contributions. It's the NHS contributions which I've missed out on

You will be even more disappointed then as it's actually a refund of your own contributions less 20% tax.  And the tax is non refundable, even if you have low income and haven't used your Personal Allowance.

But if you haven't actually had the refund yet then are you sure you have missed the boat for a transfer to another pension (of both your contributions and the employer ones?)

Yeah I understand that tax and NI are charged when refunded - hence my ultimate goal was to transfer.

But unfortunately the NHSBSA confirmed I can not transfer since over 12 months have passed. They actually give me incorrect information in one email saying I was able to, only to correct this further into the conversation. 

I may have misunderstood this (or it could be out of date) but it seems there may still be an option for you.  Do you meet these criteria?

Transferring pension rights

If you join an approved pension arrangement that is registered with HMRC you can apply to transfer your benefits to your new arrangement. To do this you, or your new pension provider, must apply to NHS Pensions.

When you have less than two years membership there are time limits to meet when considering a transfer of your benefits. To be able to transfer to another occupational or personal pension scheme or QROPS you must be under Normal Pension Age and:

 join or take out a pension within 12 months of leaving the Scheme;

 apply for a transfer within 12 months of joining that Scheme.

To be able to transfer to a buy out policy you must apply within 12 months after you leave the Scheme.

Swinton1050

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Swinton1050 said:

Hi all, looking for some advice here.

Long story short, I've recently learned that for entitlement to an NHS pension, you must be employed for over two years. In my situation, I was employed for one year and contributed the whole time.

My understanding as of now is that I had a 12month time frame to transfer my pension contributions out (including NHS employer contributions), otherwise I lose the right to employer contributions.

This was not communicated to me at the time I left the organisation, and as a result I have lost 13 months worth of employer contributions from the NHS. I asked the NHSBSA for written correspondence where this was explained to me, but they instead directed me towards their complaints procedure (which I think says it all).

Has anyone else lost out on thousands of pounds because of this? And any advice on how to proceed?

Thanks in advance for any help

What has happened to your own contributions?

I can get a refund of my own contributions. It's the NHS contributions which I've missed out on

You will be even more disappointed then as it's actually a refund of your own contributions less 20% tax.  And the tax is non refundable, even if you have low income and haven't used your Personal Allowance.

But if you haven't actually had the refund yet then are you sure you have missed the boat for a transfer to another pension (of both your contributions and the employer ones?)

Yeah I understand that tax and NI are charged when refunded - hence my ultimate goal was to transfer.

But unfortunately the NHSBSA confirmed I can not transfer since over 12 months have passed. They actually give me incorrect information in one email saying I was able to, only to correct this further into the conversation. 

I may have misunderstood this (or it could be out of date) but it seems there may still be an option for you.  Do you meet these criteria?

Transferring pension rights

If you join an approved pension arrangement that is registered with HMRC you can apply to transfer your benefits to your new arrangement. To do this you, or your new pension provider, must apply to NHS Pensions.

When you have less than two years membership there are time limits to meet when considering a transfer of your benefits. To be able to transfer to another occupational or personal pension scheme or QROPS you must be under Normal Pension Age and:

 join or take out a pension within 12 months of leaving the Scheme;

 apply for a transfer within 12 months of joining that Scheme.

To be able to transfer to a buy out policy you must apply within 12 months after you leave the Scheme.

For clarity it has been over 3 years since I left the NHS.

But one of your attached points - "apply for a transfer within 12 months of joining that Scheme" 

Is this suggesting if I join a new scheme i could transfer within 12 months of joining that scheme? Would this apply for a personal pension or have to be a workplace pension?

Thanks for the help.

greatkingrat

I'm surprised these rules are still legal. At the least the employee should be entitled to keep the minimum employers contribution under autoenrolment legislation.

Silvertabby

greatkingrat said:

I'm surprised these rules are still legal. At the least the employee should be entitled to keep the minimum employers contribution under autoenrolment legislation.

As public sector employer contribution rates are over 20%, the temptation to repeatedly opt out and cash in before each two year point could be too great for some.

Silvertabby

molerat said:

Silvertabby said:

Even if you didn't, this advice will be in the scheme information booklet, which all new members are encouraged to read.

You mean the booklet that invariably gets thrown to the back of the locker then into the bin when clearing out ?  The amount of pension booklets I found in lockers after someone left was unbelievable.

And the deferred pension information packs that I used to issue with RAF discharge documents.......the SHQ cleaners would fish them out of the waste paper bins between PSF and the outer door and return them to me.

DRS1

OP I think you should consider making the complaint.  If you did not get any communication after you left the scheme saying what your options were then I think they have messed up (I haven't checked if there is an exception for people with less than 2 years service but after you leave a scheme you are meant to get a leaver's statement showing your accrued benefits).

So I think you could argue that their mess up has led to you failing to act within the required time limit and has caused you to lose the value of the transfer payment which could otherwise have been paid.  I think I would say that the compensation for that should be to make a transfer available to you of the amount including employer contributions for a 12 month period starting on a date (the date when they make a decision under the complaints process not 3 years ago).

You would then need to find a pension which would accept the transfer (may not be that easy)

What I don't know is whether an NHS leaver's statement would include the information about transfers and time limits but I imagine it would 

I also don't know if the scheme would legally be able to make the transfer - if the time limits are written into the scheme rules. 

DRS1

greatkingrat said:

I'm surprised these rules are still legal. At the least the employee should be entitled to keep the minimum employers contribution under autoenrolment legislation.

Or an even more extreme case would be where the employee contributions are paid by salary sacrifice so they aren't actually employee contributions at all so you get no refund of them.  But maybe salary sacrifice documents cover that situation?