East Midlands Airport - VCS LTD - Petrol Station

iWindmill

Hi there,

I've read the NEWBIES guide and I'm somewhat familiar with the process after winning a process with UKCPM few years ago.

Unfortunately I got a NTK PCN today, this time from VCS at EMA within the petrol station.

Here's what happened: 

This was my first visit to East Midlands Airport, and before travelling I tried to familiarise myself with the layout and drop-off arrangements. I looked on Google Maps to understand where to go and whether the airport offered a grace period, as many other UK airports I have used provide a short 10–15-minute free window for drop-offs and pick-ups. The imagery and information available on Google Maps appeared to be several years old and did not show any clear or updated signage about current charges. Based on my previous experiences at other airports, I therefore assumed that East Midlands would have a similar system. Upon arrival, however, I was surprised to find that the minimum fee for the Rapid Drop-Off area was £5 for up to 15 minutes. As I had no cash or contactless payment method available at that moment, I decided not to enter and instead made a quick U-turn, pulling into the nearby petrol station, which appeared to be closed. I briefly stopped there to drop off my partner — the entire stop lasting no longer than three minutes — and then immediately left the area. All this happened in the early hours in morning and there were very little cars about.

[Deleted]

Also just for my own sanity in making sure I've got my head around the process - I believe the next step is to challenge the NTK PCN once as a keeper using the template within the NEWBIES guide which will likely be rejected? After this is pretty much a waiting game until LBC?

Half_way

First things forst, with this being airport land, it is not relevant land under the protection of freedoms act , that menas they cant go after the registered keeper, unless someone has blabbed as to who was driving.

  

The Above if sent is what is known as shooting yourself in the foot DO NOT SEND THAT 

Also the scum that work for, and run these un regulated parking companies read this forum - its a public open "web" site 

 I hope your username is not related in any way to your real name.

A few pointers:

You are the register keeper of X make and model of car/vehicle with a number plate of whatever.

The vehicle was used to pick up/drop someone off 

This visit took place at night during the hours of darkness and you have been informed that the drivers' attention was not alerted to any prominent illuminated signage

You, as registered keeper was surprised to find that an un regulated parking company, VCS had issued you a parking charge notice after your vehicle was used to drop off/pick up 

You are even more surprised to find them quoting the protection of freedoms act ( if they have) as the airport is not relevant land and they can only pursue the un known driver

There is no truly  independent appeal with private parking charges

If you send anything to VCS , never guess as to who could have been driving

With this being an airport site with associated by-laws it is not relevant land and as such they can not pursue the registered keeper 

If they respond with some drivel about the by-;laws being obsolete/old ( you should be looking for this reposnse) then you should take this further as by-laws are a requirement for the airports operator's licence with the CAA.

 and from there it will be a case that a body authorised by the airport (VCS) has stated that the by-laws no longer apply and from there you can stir up some issues for the Airport and the CAA 

Airport drop off fees need to be dropped, passengers already pay a high price to use the airport facilities, and these drop off fees are a relatively new occurrence, since the drop off fee was introduced it has had a knock on effect for local residents in the communities surrounding the aiport such as at neighbouring Kegworth and Diseworth, and due to a knock on issue of people waiting on the road, genuine double red lines have been introduced along the A453 main road outside the airport, as well as in Castle Donington 

iWindmill

Well great, I did send that email. !!!!!!.

Might as well pay the fine then!

iWindmill

Also I read the PCN three times now and there's no mention of POFA.

So I've done some searching for airports and byelaws and it is quite baffling as to how these parking companies are handing out fines to people when they are under no obligation to name the driver.

So it is literally a case of me responding to VCS saying I am the keeper, not the driver - you can't pursue me  since the land is non-relevant land as per POFA and I am under no obligation to tell you who the driver is. Goodbye. ????

Umkomaas

So it is literally a case of me responding to VCS saying I am the keeper, not the driver - you can't pursue me  since the land is non-relevant land as per POFA and I am under no obligation to tell you who the driver is. Goodbye. ????

No appeal to VCS will work. You could try a second stage appeal - based on not relevant land - to the IAS (after getting a VCS rejection) to see how they respond, we'd be interested to see how the ias deal with this, the law is tge law (PoFA 2012). But, whatever, you never pay any private parking charge to an unregulated parking firm unless told to do so by a Judge. I doubt that this will fall under the purview of any member of the Judiciary!

iWindmill

Umkomaas said:

So it is literally a case of me responding to VCS saying I am the keeper, not the driver - you can't pursue me  since the land is non-relevant land as per POFA and I am under no obligation to tell you who the driver is. Goodbye. ????

No appeal to VCS will work. You could try a second stage appeal - based on not relevant land - to the IAS (after getting a VCS rejection) to see how they respond, we'd be interested to see how the ias deal with this, the law is tge law (PoFA 2012). But, whatever, you never pay any private parking charge to an unregulated parking firm unless told to do so by a Judge. I doubt that this will fall under the purview of any member of the Judiciary!

I will do this - So how should I word my appeal to VCS and get their rejection, so that I can forward the same appeal to IAS? Is below enough?

I am writing as the registered keeper of vehicle regarding the Parking Charge Notice referenced above.

The parking charge was issued at East Midlands Airport. As you will be aware, East Midlands Airport is subject to its own byelaws, enacted under the Airports Act 1986, and therefore does not constitute “relevant land” for the purposes of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA).

As a result, keeper liability does not apply, and I am under no legal obligation to identify the driver of the vehicle at the time of the alleged event. Accordingly, I cannot be held liable for this Parking Charge Notice.

Should you continue to pursue this matter, please provide a full explanation of your legal basis for doing so, including confirmation of how you believe keeper liability applies on land that is expressly excluded under Schedule 4 of PoFA.

If you are unable to provide such clarification, I expect this notice to be cancelled and all related correspondence to cease.

Yours faithfully

Half_way

iWindmill said:

Well great, I did send that email. !!!!!!.

Might as well pay the fine then!

STOP its NOT a fine  you should not pay anyone.

 The IAS is not independent, or impartial, all you need to do is look into the ownership of it. 

Ditch the word Contravention, the term "alleged contravention" should become the Parking charge was issued by the un regulated parking company, VCS at East Midlands airport

iWindmill

Half_way said:

iWindmill said:

Well great, I did send that email. !!!!!!.

Might as well pay the fine then!

STOP its NOT a fine  you should not pay anyone.

 The IAS is not independent, or impartial, all you need to do is look into the ownership of it. 

Ditch the word Contravention, the term "alleged contravention" should become the Parking charge was issued by the un regulated parking company, VCS at East Midlands airport

Apologies, I replied in frustration after realizing that I may have shot myself in the foot.

Does it matter now if I continue down this route since Ioan Reed-Aspley has my email sitting in his inbox?

Also edited the appeal as per your comment (I know all this will get rejected, just wanted to get the wording right leading up to court) - will add "issued by unregulated parking company VCS" at IAS stage

Nellymoser

Care to join the 2,063 uk citizens who are asking Govt to Ban Drop-off charges at airports sign and share

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/724381

47,660 people signed the same petition on Change.org 

Coupon-mad

Just ignore them until you get a LBC.