Parkingeye

Di67

Summary: I visited the site twice (as a legitimate guest) and didn’t sign in at the machine where I was supposed to enter my reg (it was all very complex, the barrier boom arm was broken, the security guard was wearing his house robe, the phone number for the company was and still is a dudd number).
 

When the PCN arrived, I managed to emailed the company who booked my appointment, and they asked parking eye to cancel both PCNs.

Parking eye cancelled 1 of them (the 2nd and most recent one), but wouldn’t cancel the 1st one as I had already progressed through the appeals process and to POPLA.

Surely the fact that I followed their due process shouldn’t go against me, and I know the POPLA is only binding on the parking agent and not the motorist and nor does their ruling override the landowner authority.

I hadn't had time to officially appeal the 2nd one and i was waiting to see the outcome of the 1st one and hoping to hear back from the landowner / management company.

**********************************************************
Email from company who manage the land to Parkingeye 

Good afternoon, 

I can confirm that ****** was viewing a property that we manage at *******. The appointment was no longer than 15 minutes. Would it be possible to have the below fines cancelled on this occasion?

****************************************
Reply Email from parking eye to the company who manage the land

Good Morning, 

Thank you for your email regarding the above referenced Parking Charges.

******/******

We can confirm that the above Parking Charge has now been cancelled, and we consider the matter closed.
 

******/******

We note that you have requested that this Parking Charge be cancelled but unfortunately, having reviewed the case, we can confirm that this matter has progressed. In this instance, the motorist appealed the Parking Charge upon receipt but their appeal was rejected by Parkingeye. They also then lodged a further appeal with POPLA (Parking on Private Land Appeals service) but this appeal was also refused. Within the appeal decision, the motorist was advised to pay the full Parking Charge in order to avoid further action.

However, as a gesture of goodwill, we can confirm that we have today contacted the motorist with a further opportunity for them to pay the discounted amount of the Parking Charge. We have asked that payment be made within the next 14 days. 

Yours Sincerely,

Parkingeye Enforcement Team

**************************************
Email from me to parking eye enforcement team

Thank you for the gesture in relation to both these charges. 

My understanding is that the landowner retains the right to instruct cancellation at any point, even after POPLA have ruled. 

I followed the process that was presented to me in the letters, and have always stated that I was on site for a genuine purpose, this was reiterated in my appeal. I should not be penalised for following the process.

Attached is the Landowner contract that was sent to me during my appeal – it specifies the Approach to Exemption List as being “Notification to Parkingeye” on page 1. Parking eye are obligated to act on the landowner instructions. Consider the below email from the landowner/management company as said notification.

NB:

ParkingEye are an agent, acting under contract, managing the charges on behalf of the landowner. The BPA Code of Practice, Section 7 (and the new SCOP, Section 14.1) states that “operators must have written authorisation from the landholder and operate only within that authority”. i.e. the landholder retains the ultimate say. 

POPLA’s own FAQ: “POPLA is binding on the operator but not on the motorist”. POPLA are an independent appeals service and their ruling is not binding on the motorist. Also the ruling doesn’t override the landowner’s contractual authority. If the landholder requests cancellation then the agent must comply.

I do appreciate the great communication I have had from all parties in relation to this issue – but I would really like an end to it now.

Coupon-mad

You should never have tried POPLA before the landowner complaint. As you discovered, it makes PEye dig their heels in and refuse to cancel a PCN that we know (and you now know) they would easily have cancelled, if you hadn't caused them to spend time & money on pointless POPLA.

Next time, do it in the right order!

You won't get an end to it now because you tried POPLA. Not unless the landowner gets annoyed and insists on cancellation. Sit tight.

No paying.

Di67

It was a nightmare to get hold of the landowner... they're buried behind layers of management. I'll go back to them again, as they have the reference number of my appointment and were in agreement with me. I commenced the POPLA alongside my attempts to contact the landowner. My POPLA was a strong case too, citing the 9 minutes I spent on the premises (grace period), the broken boom arm, the convoluted sign in process etc... but they threw it out. So do you suggest I don't pay, go back to the landowner and if that fails... court?

Coupon-mad

Of course. We do this daily.

Di67

right then, ill strap myself in for the long ride

Di67

I managed to contact the actual landowner of the site. He then instructed the building manager to email ParkingEye to request that the PCN be cancelled. The building manager did exactly that, but ParkingEye replied refusing, saying it couldn’t be cancelled because it had already been through POPLA.

The building manager then phoned me to explain, but I insisted that they do have the ultimate authority as representatives of the landowner and should insist that ParkingEye follow their instruction. They genuinely weren’t aware that the landowner holds the final say! After I explained, they sent a second cancellation request to ParkingEye — but the operator has still refused to cancel.

Surely this puts ParkingEye outside their landowner agreement and operating without authority? Once the landowner instructs a cancellation, everything beyond that point should be out of contract and invalid. Even if the landowner later gives up, the operator’s refusal to act on that initial instruction must make any further enforcement action null and void.

Gr1pr

Its good for your case,  for you, not them , if it gets before a judge, especially if you get written proof from the landowner 

Di67

Why would they not cancel after multiple instructions from the landowner though? I have sent off a formal complaint to BPA... what are your thoughts on that line of pursuit? or is that just another board of parking company execs, regulating themselves? 

Gr1pr

Its an unregulated industry that some volunteers here have fought against for over a decade 

Nothing will change until the new MHCLG Code of Practice is implemented 

Meanwhile it's a civil dispute between you and the Privare Parking company , and possibly between the landowner and the Private Parking Company,  2 separate civil disputes 

So after over 10 years of helping people,  my thoughts are that the Private Parking Bill 2019 should be implemented ASAP,  but should have been done 5 years ago 

But my thoughts dont matter, in your case what a judge thinks matters

Coupon-mad

Depends on the agreement with the landowner. Either way this stance isn't great for ParkingEye as it pees off the landowner. Have you reported back to the landowner to tell them what their agent has said to the building manager?

You should lean on them (not the building manager - deal with the organ grinder not the monkey) again, and suggest they might decide not to renew the contract with PEye because this is clearly a farce and is unfair parking management with the tail wagging the dog. Is that really what they thought they had signed up for? Surely their agents work in the landowner's interests, not their own?

Also, it is fundamental that consumers are not allowed to be charged for POPLA (it is completely free to the public) so the fact that it cost ParkingEye a £25-30 fee should be a normal, expected business cost! It's also peanuts to them in relation to the huge profits they are rinsing from car park users here. They should certainly be prepared to absorb any costs when cancelling cases for landowners and the fact they are refusing speaks volumes about their disrespect for the landowner. There is nothing to stop an operator cancelling a PCN at ANY stage & they are lying if they say they "can't". The truth is they don't want to, which is an unfair (anti-consumer interests) ethos and an insult to genuine patrons and to the site landowner.

Tell the landowner ALL OF THE ABOVE.

And:

This is the problem with rushing to do pointless POPLA.  Never do that first!

You should have done this first. This is why it's PLAN A in the NEWBIES thread, before any appeal. You inadvertently blocked your chances of the easy cancellation route.

James_Poisson

The fact that it had been through POPLA does not mean it couldn't be cancelled it means PE don't want to cancel it because 1) they paid a fee of I think £27.50 2) they are trying to get you to pay up.