Slightly confused by these threads about penalty notices.

swingaloo

Please don't get me wrong, I am fully behind the advice given on these threads and find the whole site really useful.
But I'm slightly confused by all the 'don't pay it'. 'get it cancelled', 'ignore it' replies when it comes to parking tickets. 

If every ticket can be fought and not paid then what is the point of them in the first place. Why does anyone actually need to bother paying?

If we are saying that anyone who overstays and gets a ticket should fight it and not pay then are we not just saying that anyone can stay as long as they like anywhere and all rules should just be ignored?

I know many of these companies are rogues and fully understand not giving in to them with the excessive charges but if every ticket can be challenged then why pay in the first place.

I have just come back from a few days away with my sister and we were hurrying back to the car park as we knew we had paid for 3 hours. She was getting quite stressed about getting a penalty letter and I just said that they can be fought and told her about this site. She just replied 'So how are they supposed to control the time and parking spaces if someone who has paid for 2 hours stays for 6 and therefore parks for less than someone who has paid for 3 hours'. 
 

James_Poisson

For a start they are not penalty notices they are speculative invoices.

No regular on here agrees with people bilking, lying, or taking liberties with parking.

What this site is about is fighting scammers how is it right that any old company can set up and give a free service to a landowner for the benefit scamming motorists with silly charges and add on fees especially by using tricks and dodgy practices.

Half_way

Parking tickets issued by private companies rely heavily on what is known as, as smoke and mirrors.

@swingaloo has done by titling this topic "

Slightly confused by these threads about penalty notices" 

Private parking charges are not penalty notices, and once you get your head round that fact, they can be seen off and the victim can both gain some knowledge and save some money - and even better share that knowledge so others can save some money.

So from a PPCs perspective, why do it?

Simple, it makes money

if people think these are penalties, panic and pay at any stage then its easy money. If the process can be made complex and difficult by the parking companies and they can then start using the dreaded BIG BOLD RED  text then for very little effort people can be tricked into paying, all under the belief that these are fines or penalties and  again believing that if they don't pay it might go up

Car1980

If nobody paid all the companies would quickly go bust and cease to exist.

If the rules at every car park were as clear as they could possibly be, everything was fair and there were genuine appeals services, all the companies would slowly go bust and eventually cease to exist.

Saying everybody would overstay with no ticketing is like saying everybody would become shoplifters if Tesco got rid of all their security guards.

Emmia

Car1980 said:

If nobody paid all the companies would quickly go bust and cease to exist.

If the rules at every car park were as clear as they could possibly be, everything was fair and there were genuine appeals services, all the companies would slowly go bust and eventually cease to exist.

Saying everybody would overstay with no ticketing is like saying everybody would become shoplifters if Tesco got rid of all their security guards.

You could make the argument that if everyone parked reasonably, and paid for parking when they're supposed to... These companies wouldn't exist.

QrizB

swingaloo said:
I know many of these companies are rogues and fully understand not giving in to them with the excessive charges but if every ticket can be challenged then why pay in the first place.

From my reading of this forum on and off over several years, it seems that (regardless of the merits of any individual case) the parking management companies and their legal forms are basically incompetent.

Every PCN and court claim is riddled with holes and inconsistencies. 

If they were all to raise their game and put the effort in, they might have more of a chance of making their PCNs legal and win in court. And if they were to do this, this forum might start recommending that people settle early to reduce the cost.

But they seem quite happy doing it the wrong way and relying on fear to get payment from enough people that losing a few cases doesn't dent their bottom line.

Duke1999

Parking companies thrive by targeting easy pickings those who don't challenge unfair or excessive charges. Yet, the minority who do push back often succeed, either through discontinued claims or victories in the Civil Court. For the operators, the passive majority provides more than enough profit to sustain their business model.

James_Poisson

Emmia said:

You could make the argument that if everyone parked reasonably, and paid for parking when they're supposed to... These companies wouldn't exist.

You could also argue that if parking companies set fair charges, clear instructions, with fair above board terms and conditions, their ATA's formed a proper impartial COP and enforced it along with a proper appeals system (lets not overlook that the IAS brag to new members they reject 95% of appeals), and the PPC's consider appeals on their evidence and merit maybe it would be fairer.

The vast majority of motorists are not chancers, the PPC's only make money out of PCN's nothing else so the whole set up is about getting people to fail for their profits, there is very little car park management happening. 

Please explain how disabled bays in supermarket car parks are patrolled by ANPR?

Please explain why a car was still given a PCN when it caught fire in a Tesco car park and was taken out on the back of a lorry but both the PPC and POPLA thought that was OK as it had been on site too long?

At least authority car parks have a more sensible system, more realistic fines and a proper adjudication route not a Kangaroo court like the private sector.

BlueonBlue

"Please don't get me wrong, I am fully behind the advice given on these threads and find the whole site really useful.
But I'm slightly confused by all the 'don't pay it'. 'get it cancelled', 'ignore it' replies when it comes to parking tickets. "

If you or anyone reads the parking forum in depth.... No one ....would ask this question except the PPC plants that post utter rubbish based on a financial interest .

Your question is like asking if a home rat infestation could just be family pets !

mr_stripey

Just to play devils advocate a little bit - what do the regulars here think shops/supermarkets/stations etc should do to "police" parking? What is the best way of ensuring their genuine customers can park, but not get it overrun by non customers parking all day for free?

If it's just a free for all then the local Morrisons car park would be full of people parking there for free and then walking to their workplaces for example - then customers can't park because it is full?

Coupon-mad

Emmia said:

Car1980 said:

If nobody paid all the companies would quickly go bust and cease to exist.

If the rules at every car park were as clear as they could possibly be, everything was fair and there were genuine appeals services, all the companies would slowly go bust and eventually cease to exist.

Saying everybody would overstay with no ticketing is like saying everybody would become shoplifters if Tesco got rid of all their security guards.

You could make the argument that if everyone parked reasonably, and paid for parking when they're supposed to... These companies wouldn't exist.

Ah, if only it were that simple. But most posters here park reasonably and pay for parking.

Most cases are not about that.