Faulty Ovens and warranty

Ronaldoara

Hi all, hoping to get some advice on 2 Samsung ovens we bought in London back in March this year, which we then took to our sumemr house in Italy. Our kitchen renovations were delayed so we did not get to actually install the ovens until July. When installed, we used them for about 1 week and one of the ovens started to show an error message. a couple of days later the second oven started to show the same message. We could not use any of the ovens for our wedding party, which was really frustrating. We ended up cooking all the food at a neighbours' house. However, a few days later a really worrying development: both ovens started coming on and off completely randomly. This really scared us as it was becoming clear that this is a health hazard with potential fire risks should the ovens come on and overheat while we are out. We called a Samsung engineer in Italy and they came and replaced all the parts of the ovens they could. The ovens worked for one day and then started displaying the same error messages again. At this stage we just unplugged both ovens and left for our honeymoon. We did not contact Samsung until we got back from our honeymoon in September and we brought the ovens back to the UK. We explained to Samsung that we simply don't trust the product and that we don't feel safe. We asked for full refund, since we are within the warranty period. We were told by Samsung that the warranty is only 'repair warranty' and that they do not issue refunds for faulty products  and that the first step would be for them to try and fix the ovens. We don't want the ovens fixed, we want a refund - do we have a legal right on this as consumers? We don't mind if Samsung takes the ovens and tries to fix them again but we just don't want them in our flat (they are currently in storage). Samsung said the engineer can only come to our house to repair them and that they cannot be picked up. We live on the 5th floor without lift so it is difficult for us to bring them home from storage just so the engineers comes to repair them. Our worry is that if they are repaired, the engineer leaves and then they start playing up again, like they did before. 

What legal / consumer rights do we have in this situation?
Thank you in advance for any advice!

sheramber

Who did you buy from?

MyRealNameToo

Ronaldoara said:

Hi all, hoping to get some advice on 2 Samsung ovens we bought in London back in March this year, which we then took to our sumemr house in Italy. Our kitchen renovations were delayed so we did not get to actually install the ovens until July. When installed, we used them for about 1 week and one of the ovens started to show an error message. a couple of days later the second oven started to show the same message. We could not use any of the ovens for our wedding party, which was really frustrating. We ended up cooking all the food at a neighbours' house. However, a few days later a really worrying development: both ovens started coming on and off completely randomly. This really scared us as it was becoming clear that this is a health hazard with potential fire risks should the ovens come on and overheat while we are out. We called a Samsung engineer in Italy and they came and replaced all the parts of the ovens they could. The ovens worked for one day and then started displaying the same error messages again. At this stage we just unplugged both ovens and left for our honeymoon. We did not contact Samsung until we got back from our honeymoon in September and we brought the ovens back to the UK. We explained to Samsung that we simply don't trust the product and that we don't feel safe. We asked for full refund, since we are within the warranty period. We were told by Samsung that the warranty is only 'repair warranty' and that they do not issue refunds for faulty products  and that the first step would be for them to try and fix the ovens. We don't want the ovens fixed, we want a refund - do we have a legal right on this as consumers? We don't mind if Samsung takes the ovens and tries to fix them again but we just don't want them in our flat (they are currently in storage). Samsung said the engineer can only come to our house to repair them and that they cannot be picked up. We live on the 5th floor without lift so it is difficult for us to bring them home from storage just so the engineers comes to repair them. Our worry is that if they are repaired, the engineer leaves and then they start playing up again, like they did before. 

What legal / consumer rights do we have in this situation?
Thank you in advance for any advice!

Your consumer rights are with the retailer not the merchant so did you buy them from Samsung or from another vendor?

As the goods are over 30 days since delivery your short term right to reject has ended and the vendor would be entitled to have one attempt at repair... if they fail again after the repair then you have the final right of rejection. 

Alderbank

You say you bought two Samsung ovens 'in London'. 

Who did you buy them from?

Ronaldoara

I bought them from the Samsung shop in Kings Cross. We went back there in person and epxlained the issue but they directed us to customer service via emails

Ergates

Ronaldoara said:

We don't want the ovens fixed, we want a refund - do we have a legal right on this as consumers?

No, not initially, probably.  But it's a bit confusing now - so probably depends on how far separated Samsung the manufacturer and Samsung the retailer are.   Given how large multi national companies work - probably quite far.

A retailer is entitled to 1 attempt at repair - and this kicks in *after* you tell them about a fault (i.e. any steps you take to repair a fault *before* you tell them don't count.).   I'm willing to bet that the Samsung Italy you contacted and who attempted to repair the ovens are a separate legal entity from the company that runs the shop in London - so, despite having the same name, this wouldn't count as the retailer having had their attempt at repair.

Ronaldoara said:

Samsung said the engineer can only come to our house to repair them and that they cannot be picked up. We live on the 5th floor without lift so it is difficult for us to bring them home from storage just so the engineers comes to repair them. 

It probably doesn't have to be your actual home the engineer comes to - anywhere you have access to with a power socket will probably do (I'm assuming these are ovens that use a standard 13amp socket given you said "we just unplugged both ovens".

Ronaldoara said:

Our worry is that if they are repaired, the engineer leaves and then they start playing up again, like they did before. 

Once the retailer has had their attempt at repair (or replace), if they are still faulty *then* you can insist on a refund.   The problem is - if they're in storage, how will you know if they're faulty.

born_again

As these were bought in UK & now being used in Italy. What does the warranty say about the change of area?
Same with your consumer rights.


Basically is Samsung in Italy the same as Samsung UK?

Ergates

born_again said:

As these were bought in UK & now being used in Italy. What does the warranty say about the change of area?
Same with your consumer rights.


Basically is Samsung in Italy the same as Samsung UK?

The ovens are back in the UK - they were in Italy when they were first used (and went wrong) but now they're back.

Aylesbury_Duck

born_again said:

As these were bought in UK & now being used in Italy. What does the warranty say about the change of area?
Same with your consumer rights.


Basically is Samsung in Italy the same as Samsung UK?

And perhaps as importantly, are these ovens sold with a UK plug and produced for use on a UK mains circuit?   If they are the plug-in type (as opposed to having to be wired-in to a fused circuit) then presumably OP has either cut off the UK plugs and fitted European plugs, or used the ovens through an adapter?

Might OP's consumer (and warranty) rights be affected by the use of the ovens in a different country with different electrical regulations?  Might the "faults" have arisen from their use on a European circuit when they were designed for UK mains supply?

oldagetraveller1

It's possibly not relevant, but U.K. electricity is 50Hz and I suspect Italy is 60Hz? Some electrical components, e.g. an oven fan motor will not be suitable/happy with 60Hz. U.K. purchased ovens will be 50Hz.

I could, of course, be totally wrong!

Lomast

Electricity across Europe is harmonised at 230v 50hz so that will not be the cause of the issue