UC carers element tribunal won but

6tw6et

Just a quick description of my situation.

I am looking after somebody who is claiming PIP and his bedbound. There is plenty of documentation regarding this and I had to stop working because I'm looking after him more than 35 hours a week.

I had no clue about the carers element of UC and the DWP did not convey this information properly.

 My claim started in mid 2018 for universal credit but the carers element was only informed by me to the DWP in mid 2023 so they put it on straight away.

I would say I've been doing more than 35 hours a week since Covid started so that's roughly mid 2020. Yes it's my own fault because I should've investigated properly because I would've not have to have gone to the job centre and got more money but the job centre didn't advise me correctly and I had a lot of issues going on looking after somebody that has a lot of health problems.

I requested for it to be backdated six months and they refused. The mandatory reconsideration was refused

so I took it to a tribunal at nine months later I won.

The tribunal made them backdate the carers element for six months.

Speaking to somebody in the enhanced review team, who are just randomly checking in my ID, there is absolutely no problem with that but when the lady was on the phone she was talking to me about my claim and I should speak to different people about it to see what help I can get. He is palliative.

When I read online that plenty of people have managed to get the carers element backdated for a number of years I wish to do this now
 the reason I did not ask the tribunal to backdate it further as I thought that if they require some hard evidence which I have limited, but I have some, they might not backdate it at all... and just throw it out then I get zero

 now I need to backdate it a further 18 to 24 months previous of that as I was genuinely looking after him for more than 35 hours a week in Covid just I don't need all of the headache before, so I just left it.

I put a message in my journal and the person who is just completing my enhance review called me back saying she got the message. I didn't know she was going to get the message because it's nothing to do with her, but she was very rude on the phone and started to try to put me off back dating it... she was also complaining about how she was meant to finish work, et cetera and I just found her highly condescending. If you need to finish work then go home don't phone me.

I think the bottom line is I have a right to put in a request for the carers element to be backdated. Nobody can stop that but does anybody have any information about this? Will they actually backdate it or is it okay to backdate it even if I want to tribunal stating that I wanted to backdate it six months but I was worried they might throw it out if I tried to backdate it further but my information is accurate.

Also, is it worth complaining about that advisor that called me today because she was very rude?

huckster

You might find further backdating very difficult to achieve, as you have involved Courts Tribunal for a 6 month backdating decision. I am not sure that another Courts Tribunal will consider any further backdating, as a legal process has already been gone through and decision made.

You can complain if you wish by using the DWP complaints process which you will find online.

Yamor

Do you get Carer's Allowance as well? If yes, when did you start getting it?
Also, are you related to the person you care for? If yes, when did they start getting PIP?

6tw6et

huckster said:

You might find further backdating very difficult to achieve, as you have involved Courts Tribunal for a 6 month backdating decision. I am not sure that another Courts Tribunal will consider any further backdating, as a legal process has already been gone through and decision made.

You can complain if you wish by using the DWP complaints process which you will find online.

In the original tribunal request the dates that I mentioned have been followed and backdated... the dates that I'm referring to now, are previous to the dates the tribunal looked at

so we have not or trying to  disagree with anything the tribunal said

this is a new period... I just have been given the wrong information in the past and I felt worried if I try to claim for a longer period they might throw it all out


This woman called me back because she said as she was conducting my ID check the journal message went to her... so she has nothing to do with it then why is she calling me and then referring things to my case manager apparently?

6tw6et

Yamor said:

Do you get Carer's Allowance as well? If yes, when did you start getting it?
Also, are you related to the person you care for? If yes, when did they start getting PIP?

 I don't get careers allowance but I am entitled to it. I done see their purpose of claiming that , ( or should I?) asthey just remove it from the uc and I'm getting class three national insurance contributions anyway... and I just got told that class one open up up other benefits but I'm not entitled to anything else

The person I'm caring for has been on it for a very long time over 20 years... I live with them...my dad... there is a lot of medical evidence we can provide and it is genuinely due to this that I can't work

huckster

Up to you really. I don't see it being successful, even if you think you are asking about a different period, as a Court has already made on decision. You should have asked for longer backdating period to be considered when you applied to Court previously.

Robbie64

I agree with huckster, you really should have asked for backdating to be made for a longer period of time. There's no harm in asking for backdating to be made back to 2020 (or whenever) but you're effectively asking the DWP to supersede (effectively, replace) a decision made by a tribunal. You'll probably have your request rejected by the DWP and will probably have to go to another tribunal to stand a chance of it happening.

Were you jobseeking in 2020 to 2023? Or claiming UC as a jobseeker in that period? Did you inform your Work Coach you were looking after your dad as a full time carer during any of this period? If so, the Work Coach should really have alerted you to claiming UC as a carer. Or did the Work Coach make any allowances for you being a carer during this time? For example, reducing the hours that you had to spend looking for work. It may be that the Work Coach noted your caring responsibilities at the time which might work in your favour in establishing when your caring responsibilities exceeded 35 hours per week.

Yamor

My strong advice would be to leave it alone.

What you are looking for is a decision to change your UC award (known as a 'supersession') on the grounds that there has been a change of circumstances, but backdated for more than the 6 months you've already been given.

However, with limited exceptions, such a supersession can only take effect from the start of the AP in which you reported the change, or from the start of the AP in which the change occured (if you have good reason for reporting it late). It is not possible for the change to have occurred, say, 3 years ago, but to get 6 months of backdating even if you have good reason in that period.
As such, if the Tribunal awarded you with 6 months backdating, then you MUST have argued that the change of circumstances only actually occurred 6 months before you reported the change of circumstances.
If you now attempt to say that the change actually happened much earlier, then you are opening up the possibility for DWP to override the Tribunal decision (one of the very few situations when they can do this) on the grounds that the Tribunal decision was based on a mistake as to a material fact, and they could remove the 6 months backdating you were already given.
You couldn't even argue that you started caring for 35 hours back in 2020, but then, say, stopped caring a month or two prior to the date the tribunal awarded it to you from, and then restarted caring for 35 hours a month or two later. This wouldn't work, as although your new backdating request does not contradict the tribunal decision, it is still an entirely new request and would be stymied by the 13-month absolute time limit for backdating based on having good reason for reporting late.

And just to clarify, the cases you have heard of, where people are getting the carer element backdated for much longer, that is only where the claimant was awarded Carer's Allowance at the time (but didn't get the Carer Element added to their UC), or where the person they're caring for is a family member (meaning partner or child who lives with them, but not a father or other relatives), and that person was only awarded PIP at the time you started caring for them for 35 hours. In such cases there is a special rule which allows unlimited backdating. But this doesn't apply to you anyway.

6tw6et

Robbie64 said:

I agree with huckster, you really should have asked for backdating to be made for a longer period of time. There's no harm in asking for backdating to be made back to 2020 (or whenever) but you're effectively asking the DWP to supersede (effectively, replace) a decision made by a tribunal. You'll probably have your request rejected by the DWP and will probably have to go to another tribunal to stand a chance of it happening.

Were you jobseeking in 2020 to 2023? Or claiming UC as a jobseeker in that period? Did you inform your Work Coach you were looking after your dad as a full time carer during any of this period? If so, the Work Coach should really have alerted you to claiming UC as a carer. Or did the Work Coach make any allowances for you being a carer during this time? For example, reducing the hours that you had to spend looking for work. It may be that the Work Coach noted your caring responsibilities at the time which might work in your favour in establishing when your caring responsibilities exceeded 35 hours per week.

yes. They're all references on my journal about me having to do things at home for my parents not specifically mentioning the whole caring for 35 hours... but this was the case before and the tribunal still found it in my favour because I mentioned it to my Work called plenty of times of verbally.

Obviously, I've learnt from this to do my own investigation, which is why I'm on here now.

I don't want to put anything in place because obviously they can say why did you not mention it before but sometimes we get contradicting information. I'm not a train solicitor... main reason I didn't try to backdate it further I just thought if they throw it out, I get zero.

It was Covid so nobody was going to the job centre.... I suppose I was trying to find a job and be a carer at the same time because it wasn't expected to happen. I didn't know what was occurring.

I think the main thing here is the tribunal have a looked at it but they have looked at the specific period. I haven't mentioned anything before that.

I don't know it's a bit of a funny one that's why I'm asking

6tw6et

Yamor said:

My strong advice would be to leave it alone.

What you are looking for is a decision to change your UC award (known as a 'supersession') on the grounds that there has been a change of circumstances, but backdated for more than the 6 months you've already been given.

However, with limited exceptions, such a supersession can only take effect from the start of the AP in which you reported the change, or from the start of the AP in which the change occured (if you have good reason for reporting it late). It is not possible for the change to have occurred, say, 3 years ago, but to get 6 months of backdating even if you have good reason in that period.
As such, if the Tribunal awarded you with 6 months backdating, then you MUST have argued that the change of circumstances only actually occurred 6 months before you reported the change of circumstances.
If you now attempt to say that the change actually happened much earlier, then you are opening up the possibility for DWP to override the Tribunal decision (one of the very few situations when they can do this) on the grounds that the Tribunal decision was based on a mistake as to a material fact, and they could remove the 6 months backdating you were already given.
You couldn't even argue that you started caring for 35 hours back in 2020, but then, say, stopped caring a month or two prior to the date the tribunal awarded it to you from, and then restarted caring for 35 hours a month or two later. This wouldn't work, as although your new backdating request does not contradict the tribunal decision, it is still an entirely new request and would be stymied by the 13-month absolute time limit for backdating based on having good reason for reporting late.

And just to clarify, the cases you have heard of, where people are getting the carer element backdated for much longer, that is only where the claimant was awarded Carer's Allowance at the time (but didn't get the Carer Element added to their UC), or where the person they're caring for is a family member (meaning partner or child who lives with them, but not a father or other relatives), and that person was only awarded PIP at the time you started caring for them for 35 hours. In such cases there is a special rule which allows unlimited backdating. But this doesn't apply to you anyway.

yes... This is really interesting and it is complicated and I don't have much knowledge on it because I've only ever claimed universal credit my whole life when I wasn't working and then my dad just got really bad in Covid... there was no one else to look after him. That is the situation now.

And what I'm saying about just not knowing about the caring element was through the job centre do not properly advise you... and then when you get all panicky, you start thinking tribunal long period. They might say no et cetera.

This is one thing I didn't think about was this 13 month rule so what I'm trying to ascertain here, yes I have mentioned this to the job centre and stated to them that I'm just looking into this... at this stage, I haven't put any official request sent because I said I'm still looking at my details... this is why I want you to get some solid advice frist... so this 13 month rule basically means that it wouldn't work irrespective of what I said because if there was no point, I don't want to start it?


Let it be known there are still hundreds of thousands of people across the UK that are not claiming benefits they are entitled to. I just never thought that would happen to me but I've learned a lot from this situation. That's why I'm on here trying to get the correct information.