Ombudsman not upheld my complaint

MyRealNameToo

singhini said:

I have never understood how the scam works.

If someone rang me claiming to be the bank and is saying i need to move my money as my bank account has been compromised, my response would be "i don't need to do anything, you the bank do. Its your systems that have been compromised"

i cant think of any scenario that a bank requires you to move money. When would a bank require you to move money?

I genuinely don't understand how this scam works?

Basically because people dont think. 

The chap I mentioned had like me done 2 weeks of nearly 100 hours, we were getting ready for a high court hearing, inevitably somethings had been left to the last minute/forgotten about and had been running around like headless chickens to some degree. 

They called him 5 minutes before we were about to go in to our last board meeting before the court hearing. He was tired, flustered and was told someone was actively trying to take the £15k that was in his account. Talking about it with him afterwards he said that the thing that got him was that the caller ID came up as being his bank. He felt an idiot for falling for it, says he's lectured his kids on these kinds of things but they just got him at a time where he was stressed, thinking about a hundred different things and just fell for it. Had they called him any other time he feels he wouldnt have fallen for it. 

singhini

@eskbanker
Thankyou for posting all the links -----> so the banks do make it very clear they will never ask a person to move their money -----> so why so many people falling for this scam?

singhini

ivormonee said:

It appears the OP may have asked about this before (as per above). But, in answer to the OP: if you are not satisfied with the FO's decision and you believe you have a case, then your next port of call would be legal action against the bank, if you believe they have breached banking regulations in some way (eg. not honouring a commitment to re-imburse a victim of fraud where there were adequate signs that fraudulent activity was taking place and they failed to adequately inform the victim as per the relevant regulations).

How can the OP (or anyone else) have a case against a bank when they (the banks) make it clear that they would never ask anyone to move money? 

singhini

MyRealNameToo said:

singhini said:

I have never understood how the scam works.

If someone rang me claiming to be the bank and is saying i need to move my money as my bank account has been compromised, my response would be "i don't need to do anything, you the bank do. Its your systems that have been compromised"

i cant think of any scenario that a bank requires you to move money. When would a bank require you to move money?

I genuinely don't understand how this scam works?

Basically because people dont think. 

The chap I mentioned had like me done 2 weeks of nearly 100 hours, we were getting ready for a high court hearing, inevitably somethings had been left to the last minute/forgotten about and had been running around like headless chickens to some degree. 

They called him 5 minutes before we were about to go in to our last board meeting before the court hearing. He was tired, flustered and was told someone was actively trying to take the £15k that was in his account. Talking about it with him afterwards he said that the thing that got him was that the caller ID came up as being his bank. He felt an idiot for falling for it, says he's lectured his kids on these kinds of things but they just got him at a time where he was stressed, thinking about a hundred different things and just fell for it. Had they called him any other time he feels he wouldnt have fallen for it. 

Fine, understood.

I think its just me, im very negative about everyone and highly suspicious of everyone so don't believe most of what i hear (i also keep on phone on flight mode most of the time as i don't like talking to people). 
My approach is, if you cant get hold of me thats your problem.

Thankyou for your post

eskbanker

singhini said:

@eskbanker
Thankyou for posting all the links -----> so the banks do make it very clear they will never ask a person to move their money -----> so why so many people falling for this scam?

You've answered your own question to a certain extent, in that you were unaware that banks tell customers that until less than an hour ago!

There are plenty of savvy posters on forums like this but this isn't representative of wider society at all, and many are completely oblivious to financial security, or susceptible to fraud for a variety of reasons.

Nasqueron

singhini said:

@eskbanker
i totally agree and understand what your saying.

But every time i raise the question "When would a bank require you to move money?"   no body gives me an answer (nor have i ever seem the banks come out and say this i.e, "we would never ask you to move your money" (so im guessing perhaps they would ask you to move your money, but as i say ive never been given an answer and thus can't work out the mechanics of the scam).

Someone please enlighten me so i too don't fall victim to it

Santander especially is very VERY vigilant on these, you have to go through about 10 pages to move money to a new account even after they verify the account name etc. I routinely move money to the Edge saver and when needed for a bill, move it out, something I do the same time every month to the same account in my name, same amounts almost every time (CC bill is the only one that changes) and they still ask you to confirm it all. It's incredibly hard to get through all that without realising it's not legit to move 

Section62

Nasqueron said:

singhini said:

@eskbanker
i totally agree and understand what your saying.

But every time i raise the question "When would a bank require you to move money?"   no body gives me an answer (nor have i ever seem the banks come out and say this i.e, "we would never ask you to move your money" (so im guessing perhaps they would ask you to move your money, but as i say ive never been given an answer and thus can't work out the mechanics of the scam).

Someone please enlighten me so i too don't fall victim to it

Santander especially is very VERY vigilant on these, you have to go through about 10 pages to move money to a new account even after they verify the account name etc. I routinely move money to the Edge saver and when needed for a bill, move it out, something I do the same time every month to the same account in my name, same amounts almost every time (CC bill is the only one that changes) and they still ask you to confirm it all. It's incredibly hard to get through all that without realising it's not legit to move 

Not so sure about that.  With Santander there are simply so many pages to go through it becomes easy to just click for the next one without really reading what the page says... I can more than believe many people do simply click past the messages without taking on board what each one says.  Sometimes less is more.

It probably covers Santander well though if the victim subsequently claims they weren't sufficiently warned about scams.

MyRealNameToo

Section62 said:

Nasqueron said:

singhini said:

@eskbanker
i totally agree and understand what your saying.

But every time i raise the question "When would a bank require you to move money?"   no body gives me an answer (nor have i ever seem the banks come out and say this i.e, "we would never ask you to move your money" (so im guessing perhaps they would ask you to move your money, but as i say ive never been given an answer and thus can't work out the mechanics of the scam).

Someone please enlighten me so i too don't fall victim to it

Santander especially is very VERY vigilant on these, you have to go through about 10 pages to move money to a new account even after they verify the account name etc. I routinely move money to the Edge saver and when needed for a bill, move it out, something I do the same time every month to the same account in my name, same amounts almost every time (CC bill is the only one that changes) and they still ask you to confirm it all. It's incredibly hard to get through all that without realising it's not legit to move 

Not so sure about that.  With Santander there are simply so many pages to go through it becomes easy to just click for the next one without really reading what the page says... I can more than believe many people do simply click past the messages without taking on board what each one says.  Sometimes less is more.

It probably covers Santander well though if the victim subsequently claims they weren't sufficiently warned about scams.

HSBC Business makes you go through a load of questions including if you just update the reference to an existing payee. Its bad enough but its normally me paying myself and yet have to pick from who's told me to make the change (myself/no one isnt an option) and how was I told (again no option for "brain told fingers" and have to select from email, phone call, in person etc). 

Having looked at the stats on other FS companies transactional pages, people certainly dont read anything and often just stab at buttons to get to the next screen. People spent seconds on a page with 12 long bullets before clicking the "I agree" button and we are talking the days of dial up and ADSL and those seconds was between the request for the page being received and the click being registered on our server so time for the page to load, them in theory to read it, to scroll down, find the button, click the button and the click to make it back to the server. 

eskbanker

singhini said:

I have never understood how the scam works.

If someone rang me claiming to be the bank and is saying i need to move my money as my bank account has been compromised, my response would be "i don't need to do anything, you the bank do. Its your systems that have been compromised"

i cant think of any scenario that a bank requires you to move money. When would a bank require you to move money?

I genuinely don't understand how this scam works?

There's a bit of a giveaway at the start of the FOS description, where OP (or whoever the FOS case relates to) unwittingly opens the door to the fraudster:

He was informed that suspicious activity had been detected on his account. He recalled having recently responded to a phishing text message purporting to be from a delivery company, and the caller suggested that this may have been the point at which his accounts were compromised.

i.e. as soon as this recent phishing was divulged, the fraudster (by now rubbing their hands) is able to exploit that disclosure by using it to convince the punter of a credible reason why action was necessary.

GeoffTF

Nasqueron said:

singhini said:

@eskbanker
i totally agree and understand what your saying.

But every time i raise the question "When would a bank require you to move money?"   no body gives me an answer (nor have i ever seem the banks come out and say this i.e, "we would never ask you to move your money" (so im guessing perhaps they would ask you to move your money, but as i say ive never been given an answer and thus can't work out the mechanics of the scam).

Someone please enlighten me so i too don't fall victim to it

Santander especially is very VERY vigilant on these, you have to go through about 10 pages to move money to a new account even after they verify the account name etc. I routinely move money to the Edge saver and when needed for a bill, move it out, something I do the same time every month to the same account in my name, same amounts almost every time (CC bill is the only one that changes) and they still ask you to confirm it all. It's incredibly hard to get through all that without realising it's not legit to move 

Strangely, that does not happen to me. I have to click past criminals want it now, and a page of warnings that I have not read for years, but that is it.