Accessible housing and universal credit help

Bowiefan1972

First Post so be gentle

Really struggling with this one.

A relative of mine (brother in law) worked up until 5 years ago he is 55 now. He was 45 and sustained sepsis losing a limb and is now wheelchair bound with no prospect realistically of. returning to full time employment.  thankfully he did survive when it was touch and go in intensive  He could not continue work and had to give up when the after effects made him physically unable to. He owned his own flat by 44 after really working hard to buy it outright via right to buy. He got this flat via right to buy with the intention of leaving it to his son. As he was in relatively good health at that time he purchased a top floor flat. Now he is living a purchased flat that is largely not practical for his needs making him housebound since. The stairs are too narrow for him to get down. 

After a lot of effort we got him onto esa and now universal credit which is income based. We have tried to get him into a modified flat but ones in the local area are too expensive and every lender will not grant him a mortgage due to his  income which is understandable

The council had suggested amenity housing which is obviously high demand. He was informed due to the medical points he will be nearer the top of the list now. 

However given that he is an owner occupier he would be in the position of having to sell his flat if he was granted amenity housing. This is now causing him significant anxiety as it would take him over the savings limit for universal credit. 

I know in Scotland the law is different. We have contacted the council numerous times for advice even offering to allow them to let his flat with him receiving no income. They won't do neither. 

One of the lawyers has suggested putting the flat into a trust or changing the deeds to his son. If he sells his flat he would have to sign off universal credit and live off the proceeds of the sale. This would last him approximately 2 years. 

The alternative is either to stay in a flat that is leaving him housebound as it is not accessible for the wheelchair. Both me and my partner and his son do try to help as and where we can. It has also had very aignicant effects on his mental health.

One lawyer suggested that he may be able to either put the property in his sons name or put it in trust for his son at a future date. They suggested this only as a possibility 

He is extremely anxious as he is now caught either being trapped in his flat and wheel chair or moving to a property within a year that means he will lose his universal credit when he sells to his son his flat which gives him enough income for around for 2 years then having to re apply for his uc again which we had to fight to get him on in the first instance 

This is not intended to be any form of fraud or dodge if he gifts it to his son or puts it in trust. He would be the first one to decade the income. He is terrified of going through the assessment for universal credit after the proceeds of his sale have ran out or remain in a flat where he feels life is passing him by and causing his quality of life to be non existent. 

All the current proposed and future potential changes to universal credit and the direction of travel 

If it wasn't allowed or against the law he would never countenance it. Neither would we. Any advice suggestions or guidance would be very welcome.

Thank you for reading this long one. We just don't know best how to help and its also not helping his mental health which has taken a nose dive. His son realtistoally also does not have the funds to buy the house at market value.

If anyone has any advice we would be so grateful. Thanks in advance. 

Essentially hes faced with selling his home and living off that for a few years 2 max on current expenditure and go through the whole universal credit process again which as like many others causes significant anxiety  or being stuck in his current accommodation Indefinetly. We realise everyone has tough times especially now 

He's worked his whole life since he left school so that was a big part of his life until the illness. Please note we have looked at purchasing more suitable property but locally the sale of his flat would not get anything relatively close to meeting his needs. Please note we want to remain compliant with uc requirements at all times. We are just struggling what to do. Even getting the opinion of a property specialist wasn't clear either as we got conflicting information from 2 and have given up. 

Spoonie_Turtle

I can't help regarding his flat, but:
Does he still have an ESA claim open?  Because if so, he'd retain his (presumably) LCWRA status via that even if he had to come off UC, then later reclaiming UC he wouldn't have to be reassessed. 

(Of course there is uncertainty about what UC will look like in the future and potentially ESA down the line, but I'm just trying to find this out so as to hopefully mitigate at least some of the worry of coming off UC if need be.)

Northern_Wanderer

Does he have LCWRA currently on UC? If he does not have a current New Style Employment & Support Allowance claim, he could make one before his UC claim ends (due to capital), even if he does not have the relevent NI contributions, this will be a "Credits Only" claim which will preserve his "Support Group/ LCWRA status. Then when he comes to reclaim UC, his work status can carry back over to UC.

Putting the flat into a Trust will most likely been seen as Deprivation of Capital, and that sounds like the intention from what you have said. The capital could be disregarded for 6 months if used to buy another property. Can he not find a suitable property to buy? Capital could be diregarded for 6 months if he is actively trying to sell flat. Once he moves into the amenity housing, the property will be counted as capital, Capital limit for UC is £16k. How much capital will he have?

Does the son have LCW? If so, the property could be disregarded.

The rules for UC are not different in Scotland. Solicitors don't generally know about benefits, but they like to make money on things like setting up Trusts.

elsien

It seems like a no brainer to me.
Why would you want to stay in a flat that you are locked into and can’t get out of when you have the option not to? What does he do if he needs to go to medical appointments?
Having to use money to live on for a couple of years with a better quality of life, why would you not do that? He can reclaim again in the future, But in terms of leaving any assets to his son, first of all if he ever needs to go into care then that money would be used anyway but secondly, would his  son not prefer that he was happier with a better quality of life?

I know what I would be saying if I was his child, and it would be sod the inheritance. Let’s be honest, a lot of it was free money anyway under right to buy, so he isn’t losing out.

Bowiefan1972

Thanks for the, constructive replies. 

For medical appointments which there a lot of with the health issues  they do operate a stair lift and the ambulance will help him there. This is an ambulance for patient help attending appointmenta

For emergencies he has to get a, stretcher. Not much else can do about it right now.

Yes. If it is viewed as deprivation we would not go down this path or encourage it.  We just didn't know the ins and outs of it. 

Unfortunately we are in broad agreement with what you have said. He isn't on esa anymore. 

He's on the limited work thing for UC. (not sure on the official title sorry). He does get the adult disability payment but as we understand it this is not means tested. In any case that would not be effected?. 

Thank you everyone. Unfortunately we can't make the decision we can only guide and advise. I think his son is far more concerned with his dad's wellbeing than any material gain. Again he can only gently encourage he can't force his dad to move. 

Thank you everyone. 

Northern_Wanderer

If the person has Limited Capability for Work Related Activity (LCWRA) on UC, please do look into making a claim for New Style ESA (ns-ESA) before the UC claim ends. Any ns-ESA payments will be taken off the UC £ for £ but this is a way to retain the LCWRA so that it can be ported back to UC when the capital has reduced to below £16K and a new UC claim can be made. Even if the person does not have the relevent NI contributions to get paid ns-ESA, they can make a "Credits only claim" and get Class 1 NI credits when unable to work. This is very important for pension entitlement.

The son could live in the property and the property be disregarded if the son has Limited Capability for Work/ Work Related Activity.

Adult Disability Payment is not means tested and not affected by capital.

Best wishes.

Desperate321

Hello

I have been having a review done by universal credit and even though the housing benefit element is much lower than I receive they have been asking me to obtain a rent breakdown from the landlord but he does not offer or want to offer a breakdown. my room is fully inclusive of council tax water electric. UC are being very insistent that I have a breakdown to fully inclusive even though I have been living in my room 17 months. I have completed all the other review questions including uploading the tenancy agreement but they are asking me to again ask my landlord. I would like to post this on the forum to see if anyone else is experiencing this. 

Thank you 

elsien

Hi, you need to start a new thread for yourself on the benefits board.
It’s the red circular button with the white cross on it to start your own thread. 

Newcad

@Desperate321

It sounds from what you say that you are either renting a room in a shared 'House in Multiple Occupation' (HMO) maybe with a shared kitchen/bathroom, or that possibly you are a lodger renting a room in someones' home.
Could you clarify which one it is?

If you are in a such a private rental then you are entitled to the UC Housing Element at your relevant LHA rate, which is often/usually less than the actual rent.

For a private rental it does not matter at all what is or isn't included in the rent. - The relevant LHA rate is payable regardless.

Now for the problem that you are having:

In a Social Rental (Housing Association/council house) what is included in the rent is important because in a Social Rental you can get the full rent amount plus some service charges, so UC do need to see a breakdown for Social Rentals to see which charges are eligible for UC and which are not.
Housing associations normally issue their tenants with a new breakdown each year when the rent and service charges change in April.

However over the years UC have found that people weren't sure/didn't know which kind of housing they were in, Private or Social,  particularly those renting Housing Association properties which can be either type.
So the UC computer ALWAYS asks for a breakdown of charges, just in case one is needed.
That can lead to some poorly trained frontline staff insisting that you must give such a breakdown (because their computer is asking for one). even when one is not needed for a private rental.

If you are in a PRIVATE rental, and if the landlord is refusing to give such a breakdown, then the only thing that you can do is keep telling UC that your PRIVATE landlord is unwilling to supply one, but that as it is a Private rental one is not needed anyway because only the LHA rate will be paid anyway. Ask them to refer to their team leader or to a Decision Maker.

Have you already provided UC with a copy of your Tenancy Agreement (or lodger agreement) if you have a written one?

Desperate321

My room is HMO and yes it is a private landlord.
my rent is £860 and LHA pay £775. I have supplied UC with the tenancy agreement and a letter from the landlord who states rent is fully inclusive but offers no breakdown. UC seem very insistent and I’m worried they will stop my Housing allowance. 
Thank you so much for your reply it is very much
appreciated. 

Desperate321

Newcad said:

@Desperate321

It sounds from what you say that you are either renting a room in a shared 'House in Multiple Occupation' (HMO) maybe with a shared kitchen/bathroom, or that possibly you are a lodger renting a room in someones' home.
Could you clarify which one it is?

If you are in a such a private rental then you are entitled to the UC Housing Element at your relevant LHA rate, which is often/usually less than the actual rent.

For a private rental it does not matter at all what is or isn't included in the rent. - The relevant LHA rate is payable regardless.

Now for the problem that you are having:

In a Social Rental (Housing Association/council house) what is included in the rent is important because in a Social Rental you can get the full rent amount plus some service charges, so UC do need to see a breakdown for Social Rentals to see which charges are eligible for UC and which are not.
Housing associations normally issue their tenants with a new breakdown each year when the rent and service charges change in April.

However over the years UC have found that people weren't sure/didn't know which kind of housing they were in, Private or Social,  particularly those renting Housing Association properties which can be either type.
So the UC computer ALWAYS asks for a breakdown of charges, just in case one is needed.
That can lead to some poorly trained frontline staff insisting that you must give such a breakdown (because their computer is asking for one). even when one is not needed for a private rental.

If you are in a PRIVATE rental, and if the landlord is refusing to give such a breakdown, then the only thing that you can do is keep telling UC that your PRIVATE landlord is unwilling to supply one, but that as it is a Private rental one is not needed anyway because only the LHA rate will be paid anyway. Ask them to refer to their team leader or to a Decision Maker.

Have you already provided UC with a copy of your Tenancy Agreement (or lodger agreement) if you have a written one?

My room is HMO and yes it is a private landlord.
my rent is £860 and LHA pay £775. I have supplied UC with the tenancy agreement and a letter from the landlord who states rent is fully inclusive but offers no breakdown. UC seem very insistent and I’m worried they will stop my Housing allowance. 
Thank you so much for your reply it is very much
appreciated.