Unregistered Land

Section62

Land_Registry said:

Before widening your own detective work do speak to your conveyancer/legal rep. 
Whilst trying to understand the ownership/highway issues and more is understandable you do not want to jeopardise things as they stand as you may negate your options re indemnity insurance. 
...

Yes, for clarity, don't contact the highways department directly Kitts45 - in terms of the planning application this is something you should be able to view online and see what comments have been made by the different consultees. Nobody apart from you (and your solicitor, if you tell them) should be aware you've done this.

Any checks you make are only to inform yourself so you know what questions to ask your solicitor.

Kitts45

Section62 said:

Kitts45 said:

Section62 said:

Kitts45 said:

Section62 said:

What kind of path is it?  Is the path highway?

APing highway land can be tricky - and it has to be understood that highway rights are separate to land ownership... you can own the land, but it can also remain highway.

Was the land fenced off to stop highway users getting access to it?  Does it have any utilities (gas/water/electricity/phone) under or over it?

In terms of the planning application for the retaining wall, has this been approved or is it still pending?  Has the wall been built?  Did the council's highways department comment on the planning application?

Highway land isn't always registered, and the land under the highway (up to the centre line) may be owned by adjacent landowner, even if not shown on the title plan.  Make sure you are getting advice from a solicitor who fully understands the issues rather than one content to just solve problems with indemnity policies.  Ultimately think whether you'd go ahead with buying the property if you found out you couldn't AP this land.

Hi,
the path is just a normal footpath next to the road, the piece of land in question is above the path, it’s like a stepped walled garden up to the elevated garden. 

No one would be walking up it or using it as it isn’t a flat piece of land. 

There is a telegraph pole to the left of the property, the wire may go slightly across this bit of land but I’m not 100% sure.

The wall was granted planning permission so I wouldn’t have thought and utilities would be underneath due to footings that would’ve been put in place. 

Will check to see if Highway commented, thanks for this. 

So it sounds like a question of why this land wasn't included with the title of the property - of all the options it seems likely to be that the land is highway, or else there has been an error in the transfers/title plans at some point in time.  Roughly how old is the house, and is it part of a development/local authority build/or private?  Do any of the neighbours have a similar strip of land?

It’s an old cottage we think late 1800’s. Not part of a development but it in a conservation area. 

Yes actually the neighbour looks to have a similar piece of land, they have put a small fence at the front of theirs, their house is also elevated. Many thanks 

In which case, unless the council purchased a strip of land to widen or improve the road, there's a good chance the property owns the land up to the centreline of the highway.  However, the slope may be highway which is why the red line boundary has been drawn where it is.

I could be wrong, but I suspect you'll have problems getting AP.  It may be the highway authority decide the highway boundary is at the back of the footway or the bottom of the slope (as was), in which case you may be able to use the land without needing AP.  But it would probably be sensible to see what you can do to get the title tidied up so the red line boundary accurately shows the true position.

Any comments from the highway authority about the planning application may give an idea which way this might go.

Section62 said:

Kitts45 said:

Section62 said:

Kitts45 said:

Section62 said:

What kind of path is it?  Is the path highway?

APing highway land can be tricky - and it has to be understood that highway rights are separate to land ownership... you can own the land, but it can also remain highway.

Was the land fenced off to stop highway users getting access to it?  Does it have any utilities (gas/water/electricity/phone) under or over it?

In terms of the planning application for the retaining wall, has this been approved or is it still pending?  Has the wall been built?  Did the council's highways department comment on the planning application?

Highway land isn't always registered, and the land under the highway (up to the centre line) may be owned by adjacent landowner, even if not shown on the title plan.  Make sure you are getting advice from a solicitor who fully understands the issues rather than one content to just solve problems with indemnity policies.  Ultimately think whether you'd go ahead with buying the property if you found out you couldn't AP this land.

Hi,
the path is just a normal footpath next to the road, the piece of land in question is above the path, it’s like a stepped walled garden up to the elevated garden. 

No one would be walking up it or using it as it isn’t a flat piece of land. 

There is a telegraph pole to the left of the property, the wire may go slightly across this bit of land but I’m not 100% sure.

The wall was granted planning permission so I wouldn’t have thought and utilities would be underneath due to footings that would’ve been put in place. 

Will check to see if Highway commented, thanks for this. 

So it sounds like a question of why this land wasn't included with the title of the property - of all the options it seems likely to be that the land is highway, or else there has been an error in the transfers/title plans at some point in time.  Roughly how old is the house, and is it part of a development/local authority build/or private?  Do any of the neighbours have a similar strip of land?

It’s an old cottage we think late 1800’s. Not part of a development but it in a conservation area. 

Yes actually the neighbour looks to have a similar piece of land, they have put a small fence at the front of theirs, their house is also elevated. Many thanks 

In which case, unless the council purchased a strip of land to widen or improve the road, there's a good chance the property owns the land up to the centreline of the highway.  However, the slope may be highway which is why the red line boundary has been drawn where it is.

I could be wrong, but I suspect you'll have problems getting AP.  It may be the highway authority decide the highway boundary is at the back of the footway or the bottom of the slope (as was), in which case you may be able to use the land without needing AP.  But it would probably be sensible to see what you can do to get the title tidied up so the red line boundary accurately shows the true position.

Any comments from the highway authority about the planning application may give an idea which way this might go.

Hi, thanks. I did check planning and no comments were made from anyone which I guess is a good sign. 

Kitts45

Land_Registry said:

Before widening your own detective work do speak to your conveyancer/legal rep. 
Whilst trying to understand the ownership/highway issues and more is understandable you do not want to jeopardise things as they stand as you may negate your options re indemnity insurance. 
Such insurance is there to cover the risk of a legal owner coming forward and by doing your own detective work you can be seen as increasing that risk - the legal advice you have been given to date appears to be sound so please do rely on it and get answers to your Qs from the legal rep.

Hi thanks for, totally makes sense. I have contacted land registry but will leave it there, don’t want to void any insurance, we haven’t taken this out yet so hopefully nothing has changed. 

I did see today that’s there’s a telegraph post on the edge of the piece of land, would this affect AP? If we apply for AP and it isn’t granted doesn’t this then void the insurance? 

Kitts45

Section62 said:

Land_Registry said:

Before widening your own detective work do speak to your conveyancer/legal rep. 
Whilst trying to understand the ownership/highway issues and more is understandable you do not want to jeopardise things as they stand as you may negate your options re indemnity insurance. 
...

Yes, for clarity, don't contact the highways department directly Kitts45 - in terms of the planning application this is something you should be able to view online and see what comments have been made by the different consultees. Nobody apart from you (and your solicitor, if you tell them) should be aware you've done this.

Any checks you make are only to inform yourself so you know what questions to ask your solicitor.

Thank you, really appreciate it. Hopefully all will work out, we apply in 3 years and then we’ll be in a better position if they say it’s accepted.