Smart Meter Arqiva Mast Locations

Qyburn

Is there a online map or other source showing locations of the masts serving the Arqiva smart meter radio network? 

Ayr_Rage

I would imagine that is commercially sensitive information as they don't want the tin foil hat brigade burning them down.

debitcardmayhem

Ofcom perhaps

Ildhund

I learnt somewhere that the SMWAN aerials are in the main located on Arqiva's principal TV transmission towers, so I've referred enquirers to this map: Full service Freeview transmitters. No-one has yet come back to say that have no signal despite having a largely unhindered line to one of these masts. Apart from those in largely uninhabited bits of the highlands, I reckon most of the connectivity problems people face are caused by  conditions in the immediate vicinity of the comms hub - buildings, walls, metal shielding and so on.    

Qyburn

That's interesting. Our full service transmitter is around 26 miles away, to the SSE. Our meter is on the outside gable which faces just S of East, meaning the path to that transmitter isn't obstructed by masonry at our end.  However we get our actual TV service from a secondary transmitter, 4 miles away and on the other side of the house.

As you might have guessed I'm trying to sanity check the mix of contradictory information, misinformation and outright nonsense that I get from various parties within Octopus and from their meter installers.

The latest, from the guy who was on site yesterday was to state the the Arqiva signal comes from whichever mast we get TV from. He confirmed to me that they have no way of measuring signal strength or quality, either directly of from any indication on the equipment.  However he still positively reported back to Octopus that we had "!!!!!! poor reception", solely on the basis that the meter isn't on the wall facing that mast. 

Leading to two questions..
(1) Are the transmitters solely on the full service masts, or are they as he said also on the secondary?
(2) Can it really be the case that you can only rely on comms working if the meter is on an external wall facing roughly the right direction? If that's true there'll be zillions of meters in Scotland that can never work. Given that it's unlikely this would be a consideration when initially installing the service and meter, you could guess that only 50% would have an unobstructed path.

And the one they keep ducking, given that neither the house nor either of those masts have changed orientation, why would the meter have worked perfectly for 18 months, if the problems since October 2024 are due to  "!!!!!! poor reception"?

Every thing I hear makes me more and more convinced that Octopus are trying to claim poor WAN so that they can just wash their hands of the problem.

Rodders53

Smart Meter UHF Radio Network Coverage - Page 2 — MoneySavingExpert Forum is a relevant thread.

Arqiva own many of the UK broadcast towers and masts... and share other sites (Police, Coastguard, Rooftops)...

You could ask them.
Ofcom will likely have the information in a database somewhere.

It is possible that it may be 'commercially sensitive' in some regards, but the mobile phone mast/tower/pole data is published and that carries some even more critical services (and the South smart meter data).  As is the TV and Radio sites database.

Water metering suggests they are operating a similar, if not the same, long range radio network in England as well as the North for a different Utility to Energy.

mb21 - The Transmission Gallery has a picture of one of the transmit receive antennas on a tower at one site.

Unfortunately VHF and UHF radio reception is as much a 'black art' as it is a science...  and things can change due to reflections and diffraction off objects changing.

Have Octopus tried a FL100 flying lead module to move the Comms Hub away from the meter to a different location?
Technical information on UK SMETS 2 Smart Meters

QrizB

Qyburn said:

(2) Can it really be the case that you can only rely on comms working if the meter is on an external wall facing roughly the right direction? If that's true ...

No, it's not true. VHF radio will penetrate most structures, which is why you can get eg. Radio 2 indoors.
The only way your "engineer" could accurately report on signal strength is with a signal strength meter. From what you've said, he didn't have one.

Qyburn

Rodders53 said:

Have Octopus tried a FL100 flying lead module to move the Comms Hub away from the meter to a different location?

They have. When the guys arrived the comms hub was showing normal WAN & HAN status, flash every 5 seconds, and the meter showing "Joined". After they fitted the flying lead, relocating the hub to just underneath the meter it was stone dead, neither WAN nor HAN coming up and unresponsive to anything Octopus tried remotely. They then replaced to comms hub with a new one which showed slightly more life. That was all they could do on site.

Ildhund

QrizB said:

Qyburn said:

(2) Can it really be the case that you can only rely on comms working if the meter is on an external wall facing roughly the right direction? If that's true ...

No, it's not true. VHF radio will penetrate most structures, ... 

The SMWAN in CSP North uses UHF radio, 423 MHz except around the Fylingdales radar station on the N Yorks moors. 

As regards aerials on Arqiva masts other than the full-fat Freeview ones, it's quite possible that some have indeed been mounted. The DCC and Ofgem have probably insisted in some cases where coverage has just not been good enough, but since Arqiva claim to have met their contractual requirement of reaching most (99.3%?) households in the area, they're not going to volunteer.

QrizB

Ildhund said:

QrizB said:

Qyburn said:

(2) Can it really be the case that you can only rely on comms working if the meter is on an external wall facing roughly the right direction? If that's true ...

No, it's not true. VHF radio will penetrate most structures, ... 

The SMWAN in CSP North uses UHF radio, 423 MHz except around the Fylingdales radar station on the N Yorks moors. 

So similar propagation to PMR446 or 800MHz 2G cellphones? Should still work around corners or indoors.

Qyburn

I was surprised it's such a high frequency given the need for long range, operation where there's no clear line of sight and the relatively small amount of data to be transferred.