Judgement for Claimant

IronWolf

Hi

I have just had a court paper through the post saying that I have not replied to a claim form and therefore I am ordered to pay the claimant, DCB Legal, who have put in a claim related to a PCN.

This is the first I am hearing about this. I haven't received any court claims or papers for this PCN, and I have no idea what to do about this. Do I have to pay it?

I have received letters from DCB Legal about the PCN. I received a Letter of Claim on 20 March 25. I emailed them on 22 March with the template email and asking for an additional 30 days. I have since heard nothing and received no papers about it.

This is the letter I've just received

Umkomaas

I note you have (had) ongoing issues with a couple of other parking firms and having to update your address as parking correspondence was being issued to a former one. Is there any possibility that you did not update G24 (the Claimant in this case) with your current address?

The LoC you received in March, was this relating to G24?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6552063/pcns-being-sent-to-old-address#latest

IronWolf

Umkomaas said:

I note you have (had) ongoing issues with a couple of other parking firms and having to update your address as parking correspondence was being issued to a former one. Is there any possibility that you did not update G24 (the Claimant in this case) with your current address?

The LoC you received in March, was this relating to G24?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6552063/pcns-being-sent-to-old-address#latest

My wife has a couple of PCNs that they're pursuing, which is what my other post was about, but this one is for me from about 5 years ago. I wrote to them about changing address and that seemed to trigger them harassing me again. All the correspondence from the Letter of Claim has been sent to the correct address, but I guess it's possible something went to an old address. Is there any way I can find out what letter was sent and what the original claim was?

Umkomaas

IronWolf said:

Umkomaas said:

I note you have (had) ongoing issues with a couple of other parking firms and having to update your address as parking correspondence was being issued to a former one. Is there any possibility that you did not update G24 (the Claimant in this case) with your current address?

The LoC you received in March, was this relating to G24?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6552063/pcns-being-sent-to-old-address#latest

My wife has a couple of PCNs that they're pursuing, which is what my other post was about, but this one is for me from about 5 years ago. I wrote to them about changing address and that seemed to trigger them harassing me again. All the correspondence from the Letter of Claim has been sent to the correct address, but I guess it's possible something went to an old address. Is there any way I can find out what letter was sent and what the original claim was?

You will need to phone the CNBC to check on which address the court claim was sent to and what the Particulars of Claim (PoC) were. If you call at 08:30am, you have the best chance of getting through fairly quickly.  Leave it until later in the day, you're looking at a very long wait, often frustratingly getting cut off just as someone answers. 

IronWolf

Umkomaas said:

IronWolf said:

Umkomaas said:

I note you have (had) ongoing issues with a couple of other parking firms and having to update your address as parking correspondence was being issued to a former one. Is there any possibility that you did not update G24 (the Claimant in this case) with your current address?

The LoC you received in March, was this relating to G24?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6552063/pcns-being-sent-to-old-address#latest

My wife has a couple of PCNs that they're pursuing, which is what my other post was about, but this one is for me from about 5 years ago. I wrote to them about changing address and that seemed to trigger them harassing me again. All the correspondence from the Letter of Claim has been sent to the correct address, but I guess it's possible something went to an old address. Is there any way I can find out what letter was sent and what the original claim was?

You will need to phone the CNBC to check on which address the court claim was sent to and what the Particulars of Claim (PoC) were. If you call at 08:30am, you have the best chance of getting through fairly quickly.  Leave it until later in the day, you're looking at a very long wait, often frustratingly getting cut off just as someone answers. 

ok thanks. I'll get on the phone to them.

Umkomaas

IronWolf said:

Umkomaas said:

IronWolf said:

Umkomaas said:

I note you have (had) ongoing issues with a couple of other parking firms and having to update your address as parking correspondence was being issued to a former one. Is there any possibility that you did not update G24 (the Claimant in this case) with your current address?

The LoC you received in March, was this relating to G24?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6552063/pcns-being-sent-to-old-address#latest

My wife has a couple of PCNs that they're pursuing, which is what my other post was about, but this one is for me from about 5 years ago. I wrote to them about changing address and that seemed to trigger them harassing me again. All the correspondence from the Letter of Claim has been sent to the correct address, but I guess it's possible something went to an old address. Is there any way I can find out what letter was sent and what the original claim was?

You will need to phone the CNBC to check on which address the court claim was sent to and what the Particulars of Claim (PoC) were. If you call at 08:30am, you have the best chance of getting through fairly quickly.  Leave it until later in the day, you're looking at a very long wait, often frustratingly getting cut off just as someone answers. 

ok thanks. I'll get on the phone to them.

Come back and let us know. Whatever the outcome of the phone call, the Judgment in Default must be dealt with. You cannot ignore it - but how you might deal with it will be influenced by what the CNBC says. 

IronWolf

I got through to them ok. So the court claim was apparently sent to the correct address and they've emailed me the claim details. I have no idea why I didn't receive it but not much I can do about it. The claim is just the usual PCN stuff.

They said I can submit a form N244 and apply to have the judgment set aside, but the fee for doing that is over £300. I'm absolutely livid. I can't even find the exact fee because the website with fees has so many it's impossible to find and they don't refer to the form number. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/fees-in-the-civil-and-family-courts-main-fees-ex50/civil-court-fees-ex50 

Gr1pr

I think that its currently about £313

https://www.gov.uk/county-court-judgments-ccj-for-debt/cancel-the-judgment

Its also worrying that they used the correct address and yet you didn't receive the paperwork,  despite receiving the LoC a couple of months ago 

IronWolf

I don't know if I can be bothered defending this. I don't know what the chance is I can get that fee waived or counterclaim for it. My earnings are too high to get a fee waiver based on that.

The small claims system is a joke. They send you one letter and if you miss it, tough? You can't even search online to see if there are outstanding claims against you. Thank God I got the second letter or I'd really be screwed.

doubledotcom

For a claim issued through Money Claim Online (MCOL) the court, not the claimant, undertakes the physical act of posting the claim form.

If the defendant never received the papers the presumption of service can be rebutted. The court does not expect the defendant to prove a negative. What the defendant must do is provide a clear, credible Witness Statement (WS) saying the claim form did not arrive, explain how and when they first learned of the proceedings (for example from a default judgment notice), and show that they acted promptly once aware. Evidence such as correspondence with the claimant in response to the Letter of Claim (LoC), proof that mail normally reaches the address, or examples of other items received at the same time can add weight, but the sworn statement itself is accepted unless the court has reason to doubt it.

With a default judgment already entered, the correct step is an N244 application to set the judgment aside. The witness statement for that application should:

• state that no claim form, particulars, or MCOL access details were received at the service address,
• quote PD 7C 5.7 to show when service is deemed and that the presumption is being rebutted,
• confirm the date and manner in which the defendant first became aware of the judgment, and
• ask the court to set the judgment aside under CPR 13.2 (mandatory where service was not effected) or, alternatively, under CPR 13.3 (discretionary where there is a real prospect of defending and the application is made promptly).

Once the judgment is set aside the claim returns to the normal track and the defence can be filed.

IronWolf

doubledotcom said:

For a claim issued through Money Claim Online (MCOL) the court, not the claimant, undertakes the physical act of posting the claim form.

If the defendant never received the papers the presumption of service can be rebutted. The court does not expect the defendant to prove a negative. What the defendant must do is provide a clear, credible Witness Statement (WS) saying the claim form did not arrive, explain how and when they first learned of the proceedings (for example from a default judgment notice), and show that they acted promptly once aware. Evidence such as correspondence with the claimant in response to the Letter of Claim (LoC), proof that mail normally reaches the address, or examples of other items received at the same time can add weight, but the sworn statement itself is accepted unless the court has reason to doubt it.

With a default judgment already entered, the correct step is an N244 application to set the judgment aside. The witness statement for that application should:

• state that no claim form, particulars, or MCOL access details were received at the service address,
• quote PD 7C 5.7 to show when service is deemed and that the presumption is being rebutted,
• confirm the date and manner in which the defendant first became aware of the judgment, and
• ask the court to set the judgment aside under CPR 13.2 (mandatory where service was not effected) or, alternatively, under CPR 13.3 (discretionary where there is a real prospect of defending and the application is made promptly).

Once the judgment is set aside the claim returns to the normal track and the defence can be filed.

Thanks for the comprehensive answer. So presumably, whatever happens I'll be out of pocket at least £313? Doesn't seem worth it tbh.