Parking charge PCM - done it all wrong, need guidance...

FatToni247

Summary of parking situation:

• Had been parking in 'visitors' parking spot for 3 years - when visiting my partner. 
• Had been using council paid visitors parking tokens believing this was valid as his contract discusses resident and visitors parking permits - never got a ticket for parking in this space in 3 years.
• Residents of the same area (imagine the street is called 'Blueberry') have decided to put in private parking, but not communicated this to the whole of 'Blueberry'. This was unbeknownst to those on half of Blueberry - as I learnt after my complaint to the management company, this is because half of Blueberry is council owned and the other half is owned by a management company? 
• The signs put up are in the same font and colour as the council, and are not clear when saying what app is required to be used for a visitor permit - simply says 'have a visitors permit online'. I WANT TO EMPHASISE THAT IF THE SIGN WAS CLEAR, I WOULD HAVE ACTED ACCORDINGLY.
• The signs have been up for ~3 weeks and I continued to use the visitor permits from the council believing this was correct. I did not receive any tickets in this time - so continued to believe I was doing this correctly whilst parked in the bays.
• I then received a parking charge notice on 22/3/25 from Parking control management Ltd (PCM), this was received in the early hours of the morning

Unfortunately, I am inexperienced in these things and didn't think to read threads etc... I didn't even know there was a difference between penalty and parking charge notices. So I immediately appealed, stating that the sign is not clear, that on entrance there is a sign from the council stating permits are required in a certain time of hours - which is confusing etc and that I have a permit for parking etc... 

Stupidly my message identifies myself as a driver.

Obviously my appeal was rejected because they said I didn't have the correct parking permit for them - but they sent it to the address of the person I was visiting. 
They have now followed up with a debt collector charge - again sent to the wrong address.

Do I have to:
1) Inform them of my actual address or wait for them to do it via the DVLA?
2) How would you approach this as I've given up my right from the angle of 'no notice to keeper'?

Thank you. 
If there are any other questions, I am happy to answer.
I will upload evidence of the letters I have received shortly.

Car1980

3.4 material notices: Where there is any material change to any pre-existing terms and conditions that would not be immediately apparent to a driver entering controlled land that is or has been open for public parking, the parking operator must place additional (temporary) notices at the site entrance for a period of not less than 4 months from the date of the change making it clear that new terms and conditions/charges apply, such that regular visitors who might be familiar with the old terms do not inadvertently incur parking charges.

NOTE: Examples of material changes can include introduction of parking enforcement where none has previously applied, introduction of time-limited free parking, or reductions in the time limit within which free parking is available. Given the need to avoid confusion and clutter at entrances the test is whether the fact that a change has been made is clearly signalled to drivers on entering the land and the nature of the change is clearly displayed thereafter – it may also be necessary to install repeater notices depending on the scale of the premises.

Their code of conduct instructs them to do this and presumably they didn't. Just ignore their threatograms and come back if you get a Letter Before Action was a solictor / bulk litigator.

Can you show us the signage?

Coupon-mad

Yep show us their sign please.

DO NOT PAY.

DO NOT PARK IN THE PCM AREA, EVER.

but they sent it to the address of the person I was visiting. 
They have now followed up with a debt collector charge - again sent to the wrong address.

You must give them the right address. How did they get the wrong address, from your appeal?

Was it a windscreen PCN?

FatToni247

So the first sign is the one on entry into the close, which was originally the only sign that existed suggesting the requirement for a permit.


Then they put this sign on the fence in the parking area marked as visitors. 



I think that the wording is vague - a 'valid virtual visitor parking session' could be anything. That little picture they've put with their logo contradicts that. If they have out 'a valid virtual visitor parking session on the PCM app' that would be a different story...

FatToni247

Car1980 said:

3.4 material notices: Where there is any material change to any pre-existing terms and conditions that would not be immediately apparent to a driver entering controlled land that is or has been open for public parking, the parking operator must place additional (temporary) notices at the site entrance for a period of not less than 4 months from the date of the change making it clear that new terms and conditions/charges apply, such that regular visitors who might be familiar with the old terms do not inadvertently incur parking charges.

NOTE: Examples of material changes can include introduction of parking enforcement where none has previously applied, introduction of time-limited free parking, or reductions in the time limit within which free parking is available. Given the need to avoid confusion and clutter at entrances the test is whether the fact that a change has been made is clearly signalled to drivers on entering the land and the nature of the change is clearly displayed thereafter – it may also be necessary to install repeater notices depending on the scale of the premises.

Their code of conduct instructs them to do this and presumably they didn't. Just ignore their threatograms and come back if you get a Letter Before Action was a solictor / bulk litigator.

Can you show us the signage?

Thank you for this!
Is there any weight in the fact that whilst I parked there, I didn't receive any PCN for ~3 weeks? 
They didn't stick to their '24 hour rule' at all, which also contributed to the ambiguity...

FatToni247

Coupon-mad said:

Yep show us their sign please.

DO NOT PAY.

DO NOT PARK IN THE PCM AREA, EVER.

but they sent it to the address of the person I was visiting. 
They have now followed up with a debt collector charge - again sent to the wrong address.

You must give them the right address. How did they get the wrong address, from your appeal?

Was it a windscreen PCN?

Yes, it was a windscreen PCN. Also, when I appealed, I thought I had to put the address of who I was visiting because that is where it happened. 
Who do I inform of my address change, the debt collector (Trace?)

Coupon-mad

Both, to their DPO emails (see their privacy pages).

Then ignore them, unless you move house again (repeat the update) or if you get a solicitor's LBC that we assume by now you'll have read about, when you read the second post of the NEWBIES thread.

FatToni247

Just an update - have been sent a Notice before Claim from MoorsSolicitor!

FatToni247

Car1980 said:

3.4 material notices: Where there is any material change to any pre-existing terms and conditions that would not be immediately apparent to a driver entering controlled land that is or has been open for public parking, the parking operator must place additional (temporary) notices at the site entrance for a period of not less than 4 months from the date of the change making it clear that new terms and conditions/charges apply, such that regular visitors who might be familiar with the old terms do not inadvertently incur parking charges.

NOTE: Examples of material changes can include introduction of parking enforcement where none has previously applied, introduction of time-limited free parking, or reductions in the time limit within which free parking is available. Given the need to avoid confusion and clutter at entrances the test is whether the fact that a change has been made is clearly signalled to drivers on entering the land and the nature of the change is clearly displayed thereafter – it may also be necessary to install repeater notices depending on the scale of the premises.

Their code of conduct instructs them to do this and presumably they didn't. Just ignore their threatograms and come back if you get a Letter Before Action was a solictor / bulk litigator.

Can you show us the signage?

Just head a Letter Before Action from Moors Solicitors. Going to read the Newbies thread and get to moving along with this. 

Johnersh

Presumably the council is landlord of their bit and hasn't consented to use of a ppc. That means visitors to their tenants technically cannot be issued a PCN. There should be clear zoning of the site, if that is the case.

The sign at the perimeter is a council sign and is self-evidently in conflict with the private repeaters.

The witness evidence on this will be interesting 

Coupon-mad

FatToni247 said:

Just an update - have been sent a Notice before Claim from MoorsSolicitor!

Nope. No such company and no such letter.

You have a standard LBC from Moorside legal, same as all the rest here. Read a few threads; this is a 'nothing' stage already fully covered in the NEWBIES thread post 2.